Thread: Perms

So I have really long, fine, straight, thin hair and have been considering getting a perm. My hair likes to be straight and flat and doesn't take well to curling or styling (except for a fine crimping iron). I'd like it if I could get some volume out of my hair! Maybe get a wavy perm or something.

I am wondering if there are any of you long, fine hairs out there who have gotten perms? Did you have a good or bad experience? Before and after pictures? Did you get really curly or just waves? How long did it last/ how often did you have to return to get it repermed? What can I expect to spend if I go to a stylist? Which do you prefer, stylists vs. home perm kits? Is permed hair more expensive or difficult to take care of? Anyway, if you have any other comments, tips, or hints, post them here too!

I was a hairdresser in prime perm period (the 80s) and I had long permed hair at various times.

Don't home perm.

A lot depends on the texture of your hair, how resistant it is. Some fine hair is glassy, some is what I would call chewy, almost like frizzy hair with no actual wave. It feels damaged. If you have the latter you have really difficult hair - but you also probably don't because hair like that is awful long. It's likely you have hair that is more like the former, quite resistant. That and the length means you'll have to go curlier than you probably want. Big waves will just fall out.

Perms look fairly awful when they start to grow out, and when you get them redone you risk further ongoing damage to the ends. Some people will just do the roots but it's pretty hard to get them to match up.

Perming will fundamentally alter the chemical structure of your hair and damage it. Your hair will be more fragile. But it will also hold a set better.

In the 80s I did the spiral perm thing, which is the best for long unlayered hair, I believe. But it's a very specific look.

Perming long hair is expensive. It makes the hair drier and more fragile, so you will need to condition it more deeply and ensure the ends are regularly trimmed. It will take a set better though. But do you want to go to the trouble of perming only to need to set the hair all the time?

Have you tried having your own hair layered at all? A few long layers and a wet set might give you the look you want without damage. OTOH without looking at your hair I can't tell whether it is the kind of hair that needs to be one length.

Again, do NOT home perm your long hair. The chances of you completely ruining it are very high.

Originally Posted by zumarrad

Don't home perm.

Again, do NOT home perm your long hair. The chances of you completely ruining it are very high.

As another cosmetologist, I 2nd, 3rd, and 4th this. Everything else Zum said is also correct and ITA.

Coloring your hair adds body, the semi-permanent dyes look nice and fade out without a harsh line at the roots. Talk to your hairdresser about a color that would work well with your natural color as it fades out. My hairdresser uses a technique where she takes little snips underneath the top layer to add fullness. I also use a product called Bohemian Beach spray to add texture and volume.

I feel your pain, I have "frog feather" hair and I wear hairpieces when I perform, it's much easier than trying to do stuff with my own hair, and I can keep my mundane hairstyle shorter than I like for the long-haired belly dancer look that I like when performing.

My fine hair is about 3" below bra strap length. I caved and had a spiral perm done last year. I regretted it after about the 2nd week and am happy that it is finally relaxed enough (and the bangs have grown out enough) to be straight again. I would not do it again, my hair got very dry and I had lots more breakage even though I was very careful with it. It was constantly knotted and tangled. Now when I want the curly girl look, I just either reach for my hairpieces or braid my own hair in, sleep with that, spray the heck out of it and unbraid and shake them out.

You might also try a 3-barrel curling iron. I also have fine hair and it makes it look very full and a softer look than a crimper.


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And if you're prepared to take the time, check out Bantu or Zulu knots. If you do them on wet hair and make sure it's really dry before you take them out, and just fingercomb, you will get lovely natural-looking waves. You can experiment with the size of the section you take - I'd make them fairly big to get a looser curl.

A friend of mine who had hair similar to what you describe put her hair in Zulu knots for a week and when she took it out she had fantastic Studio 54 frizz. Way better than crimpers and safer for your hair!

i had a spiral perm in the 90s and it really damaged my hair and also changed the color of it from dark brown to a reddish brown. i would say dont get a perm

Oh, yes! Perming will typically lighten hair a shade or two because of the peroxide in the neutraliser. I still remember a terrible dream I had where I "had" to sell a perm client a semi-permanent colour, but I could see already that the neutraliser had lifted her dark hair to a stunning chestnut shade and it did not NEED a colour! I even had itchy hands from the dream neutraliser. I was a baby hairdresser at the time and hated the sales pressure.

I love the look Kiyaana gets using a three-barrel iron on her fine, straight hair. I don't think she'll mind my reposting an after-gig pic from the "what are you working on" thread:

I have long fine hair and I'm begging you not to perm - when you first get it done it's going to look took curly and by the time it 'drops' your roots will have come through and be straight and that just makes hair look BLAAAAH and then the really bad bit: you'll find your hair is damaged and the ends will look like fairy floss so you'll have to get those cut off....and then you'll end up with short hair (can you tell I've lived the nighmare? LOL)

I've had many perms and the most freeing thing a hairdresser did for me once was just to look me in the eye and tell me to give up the dream and accept I have stick-staight hair. It hurt, he had to repeat it to me a few times but the lesson sunk in and I will be eternally grateful.

Does it stop me WANTING curly hair? nope....so I try other methods which mainly involve twisting the hair after it's been washed and dried and, sure, it isn't perfect but it's so much better for my hair in the long run. If you are intersted in hair wrapping there is another post on it at: http://www.bhuz.com/forum/belly-dance-beauty-costuming/43484-hair-wrapping-straight-hair-without-using-heat-tools.html and if you look in that post at the video titled 'how to create waves the easiest way' you'll see the best, quickest and fuss-free technique I use.

I dont have fine hair, it is coarse and frizzy. Every 15 years or so I forget how bad it was, and do it again. I am due in another 10. Just one word...dont!

Thank you all for saving me from myself!!! I am most definitely NOT getting a perm now! I'm glad that I put it to the community... figured there'd be stories like these.

I'm going to give one of those three barrel curling irons a try as well as the bantu knots. I studied abroad in South Africa for a while and liked that hairstyle anyway, so now I have an excuse to try it.

I have long, very thin, completely straight hair. It has a nice color and sheen and I get lots of compliments on it, but I don't like it at all. All those women out there who straighten their hair just don't know how lucky they are to have waves and curls.

I've never "done anything" with it but have been meaning for a while to start curling it or crimping it some of the time. I've never used a curler or anything though so I'm not really sure where to start. I'd like to braid it wet and leave it overnight but that is so time-consuming and anyway I can't do all the braids myself.

Originally Posted by zumarrad

And if you're prepared to take the time, check out Bantu or Zulu knots. If you do them on wet hair and make sure it's really dry before you take them out, and just fingercomb, you will get lovely natural-looking waves. You can experiment with the size of the section you take - I'd make them fairly big to get a looser curl.

A friend of mine who had hair similar to what you describe put her hair in Zulu knots for a week and when she took it out she had fantastic Studio 54 frizz. Way better than crimpers and safer for your hair!

Are these knots basically just dividing your hair into a bunch of little twisty-buns?

Are these knots basically just dividing your hair into a bunch of little twisty-buns?

Yes. Google and you'll find heaps of tutorials, mostly directed towards African American hair but it still works for you. You will probably need to pin the hair in place though. Basically, you take a section, twist twist twist till it starts to turn back on itself, wrap the remaining long twisted hair around and around the bit that's sticking out from your head, and pin at the root.

Rag curls are another option.

I used to wear Bantu knots a lot before I locked my hair. I still do them if I want to give my locks some wave/curl.

Originally Posted by zumarrad

Yes. Google and you'll find heaps of tutorials, mostly directed towards African American hair but it still works for you. You will probably need to pin the hair in place though. Basically, you take a section, twist twist twist till it starts to turn back on itself, wrap the remaining long twisted hair around and around the bit that's sticking out from your head, and pin at the root.

Rag curls are another option.

Years (& years lol) ago when my fine hair was long & wavy, I would make little twisty buns, 2, or 4, or more across my forehead to keep my hair out of my eyes or if it was hot. And some in the back sometimes. Just because. My friends called them my fun buns. They stayed without any hairpins for some reason, and when I took them out, my hair waved about nicely. My sisters also did this, we thought it was some kind of goofy family thing.

[QUOTE=Mihrbanu;679788]I'd like to braid it wet and leave it overnight but that is so time-consuming and anyway I can't do all the braids myself. QUOTE]I have long hair that I manage to braid all by myself. You don't have to do very many to get a nice wavey effect. I find it important though to braid tight and close to the scalp. Doesn't even have to be neat or even. I actually find it easiest to flip my hair upside down and braid that way. Takes me about 10 minutes at most to braid 8 - 10 braids. Since you haven't done it before, you might be surprised at how quickly it goes.

I've done the braid thing and like the effect, but I'm a day showerer (pretty oily skin) and trying to figure out how I would do that... maybe it's something I could only do for gigs or mornings where I have a lot of time to let it dry in braids before I brush it out.

I do love my hair layered... perhaps I should go get a trim and layer soon. I don't have the money to do it often and my hair all grows out within two months! Maybe I should just set it aside in the budget as a necessity.

Thanks for all of the awesome suggestions guys!

Oh my! Curls! I just tried Bantu Knots for the first time last night. Took them out this morning and I love the look. I also knotted some of my clip-in extensions and they turned out just as curly (they're human hair). I made a total of 8 bantu knots and it turned out the way I wish my perm had. Here's a scary, no-makeup, w/o extensions photo.
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I have very fine hair, but there's lot of it, which makes it quite thick. Perms have never worked on me, always a disaster, never never again. I had mine trimmed last week and my hairdresser told me off for straightening my hair every day and damaging it (I have kind of a kink in it, neither straight nor curly!) and sold me the latest gizmo. Its a hairdryer with a special attachment, looks kind of like the old afro combs but a double version with the heat being directed down the middle between the two 'combs'. Basically you just tip your head upside down and comb through with the hairdryer attachment until it's dry. It sounds like it would turn out a total mess but it really doesn't. It gives it loads of volume and I haven't needed to straighten it (apart from the fringe which is sticking out a a 90 degree angle by the time I've finished..l;,). Best 25 quid I've spent in ages. Made by WAHL. would recommend it you're looking for volume.

Originally Posted by Lesedi

I've done the braid thing and like the effect, but I'm a day showerer (pretty oily skin) and trying to figure out how I would do that... maybe it's something I could only do for gigs or mornings where I have a lot of time to let it dry in braids before I brush it out.

Well, shower caps are not pretty but that is exactly what they are made for! Or, in a pinch, a plastic grocery bag over your hair and clipped tightly closed. I braid mine at night, cap my hair for my a.m. shower, then I leave it braided for the day, usually clipping it back in a claw clip or ponytail holder. Then I just hairspray it before unbraiding, shake it out and gently finger separate the braids before my performance. (Don't brush it!) Plus, try it out for fun well before you want to wear it for dancing.

Originally Posted by Lesedi

I've done the braid thing and like the effect, but I'm a day showerer (pretty oily skin) and trying to figure out how I would do that... maybe it's something I could only do for gigs or mornings where I have a lot of time to let it dry in braids before I brush it out.

I do love my hair layered... perhaps I should go get a trim and layer soon. I don't have the money to do it often and my hair all grows out within two months! Maybe I should just set it aside in the budget as a necessity.

Thanks for all of the awesome suggestions guys!

You could put your hair in a shower cap to keep it dry. I shower each morning and that's what I would do. Of course then your hair doesn't get washed.

Originally Posted by Nebula

Oh my! Curls! I just tried Bantu Knots for the first time last night. Took them out this morning and I love the look. I also knotted some of my clip-in extensions and they turned out just as curly (they're human hair). I made a total of 8 bantu knots and it turned out the way I wish my perm had. Here's a scary, no-makeup, w/o extensions photo.
Attachment 17823

Awesome! Thanks for sharing the pic!