Thread: Ghawazee Costumes

Okay, so like I'm thinking about Ghawazee. What would you wear if you were going to do a lively Ghawazee dance? Would a simple galabeya with hip scarves, head covers, and maybe some coins be appropriate? I don't want to go out and spend a lot of money, but I like to look as authentic as I can.

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This is our attempt. No not totally authentic but based on old painting (of which there are many on the net) We were hauled up for having dreads rather than plaits! Our excuse..very much a theatrical representation. but no reason why you cannot wear a gelabeya and full head costume. I do think the big bloomers lend something.
But of course the Ghawazee changed their costumes through the decades and ended with dresses.

We're doing old school Mazin-style taj, jackets and short skirts which is SO much fun and so different!

For what it's worth, according to Cassandra they do not cover their hair bar the taj and a little scarfy thing - hair is loose and long - and they always wear shoes.

Generally speaking you can do the dress and scarf, yeah, but if you want people to KNOW you are a ghawazee the costume really does help.

I think the costume sort of depends on what kind of performance you want to create. The Ghawazee coat-style costume has become, at least in my mind, more of a fakelore thing than serious attempt at cultural representation. I know there is historical evidence behind the coat and there are dancers out there who really put a lot of careful research into creating historically consistent costumes, but in my experience, when a dancer walks on stage in a Ghawazee coat, it's more likely to be the sword-and-Solace fantasy recreation vibe than "Let me show you what I learned in Egypt when I visited the Maazin family." I expect a higher standard of authenticity in presentation when someone wears the Banat Maazin style costume.

I'm afraid if you just wear galabeyas and hip scarves, it will come across as plain "baladi," and the impact of it being Ghawazee will be lost because the costume isn't specific enough. There are patterns available to make the folkloric Ghawazee coat, and if you're a clever seamstress, you could probably make your own by adapting a regular coat or dress pattern. If you want to go the other route, you could make a lo-fi knockoff of the Banat Maazin costumes by jazzing up a full, knee-length skirt and a leotard with coins and fringe, and then add the crown. If you really want to do it quick/cheap/dirty, making fringed glitter-dot overlays in pretty, bright colors for the skirt and neckline of the leotard would probably capture enough of the feel of the real costumes to squeak by at dance event. (I wouldn't use it for a serious cultural gig, though...) GS has a lot of pictures--for example, here http://www.gildedserpent.com/cms/200...ermazinphotos/, http://www.gildedserpent.com/art30/c...tarsspread.htm, and http://www.gildedserpent.com/enearin...ghawazich8.htm. The last one talks about how the Maazin girls switched to the crown from the older mandil, so if you don't want to make your own taj and you have a decorated scarf, you can go that route, too.

Toureau sorry the coats offended you but our routine was a tableau of the 19th century and we along with extras(actors) tried to represent (albeit in a theatrical way) by copying the orientalist paintings. No way did we dance with swords to Solace.
We had learnt the steps from a specialist teacher ( again albeit NOT the Maazin) but one who had studied the Ghawazee.
But sigh you cannot please all of the people all of the time. In the old film clip of the Maazin loaded recently in various places they were wearing full headdresses.
As the OP was stating they did not expect to look entirely authentic so they have some leeway. Agreed a plain gelebeya might not send out enough of a ghawazee message which is why I suggested the large bloomers.
I was,after all only trying to be helpful.

This is footage of the Maazin sisters in an old black and white movie...



Hope this helps!

[QUOTE=Tourbeau;784414]"and there are dancers out there who really put a lot of careful research into creating historically consistent costumes, but in my experience, when a dancer walks on stage in a Ghawazee coat, it's more likely to be the sword-and-Solace fantasy recreation vibe than ...."

How many ghazwazee performances around the world have you seen personally then? How much "experience" exactly have you had?,m::

"I expect a higher standard of authenticity in presentation when someone wears the Banat Maazin style costume. "

Oh DO YOU NOW...sorry Tourbeau you upset a lot of Bhuzzers including me in one of your posts before Bhuz went offline, just so we know WHO ARE *YOU* to say you expect a higher standard of authenticity in presentation? Are you one of the Maazin sisters or was you a Ghawazee in a past life?

I'm really quite fed up with your "Know it all" attitude and posts slagging off your fellow dance sisters calling them rag tag dancers in mismatched costumes when *you*haven't got the decency to even have a public photo of yourself. You are always writing posts in a tone of authority, so unless you're prepared to show yourself and tell us just where you got your "experience" from and HOW LONG YOU HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN BELLYDANCE then please stop touting yourself as the font of all ME dance knowledge.

Originally Posted by lizajuk

Toureau sorry the coats offended you but our routine was a tableau of the 19th century and we along with extras(actors) tried to represent (albeit in a theatrical way) by copying the orientalist paintings. No way did we dance with swords to Solace.

I never said that it offended me for people to wear the coats. I said that my personal experience reflected that dancers in the areas where I have lived usually wear them for sword dancing and very "loosely inspired" faux-historical performances to non-historical music. I realize that many dancers put substantial, serious, academic effort into trying to recreate Orientalist paintings or Victorian travel descriptions, they refer extensively to Tilke during their preparation, and so on, which is why I wrote, "I know there is historical evidence behind the coat and there are dancers out there who really put a lot of careful research into creating historically consistent costumes...." But I don't live near Aisha Ali. I live where dancing with a sword to Solace in a Ghawazee coat has happened often enough that it's become a stereotypical cliche to describe a much less rigorous approach.

I was,after all only trying to be helpful.

And I wasn't trying to imply you weren't or that there was something wrong with your performance. I'm only reporting my experience from the other side of the world, where the coats are more likely to have this other association, than to represent a serious commitment to ethno-historical recreation.

Originally Posted by nikkiraqs

(quoting me) "I expect a higher standard of authenticity in presentation when someone wears the Banat Maazin style costume. "

To clarify, when you put on the Maazin costume, I feel you are showing that you have done your research and you are attempting to create a very specific cultural experience. You are carrying forth the life's work and (dying) traditions of real people--not presenting art as an abstract concept or a primary vehicle for your personal expression. Most audiences don't expect to see a "belly dancer" dressed like that, so you are assuming the responsibility for educating them on behalf of the Banat Maazin. You're representing the Maazin family and everything they stand for. That, to me, is a "higher standard."

BTW, Bhuz very helpfully provides a feature to block users if their posts are not to your liking.

From the FAQ:
If there are particular members that bother you and you do not want to see their posts or receive Private Messages and Emails from them, then you can add these members to your 'Ignore List'. There are several ways to do this:

Through your User Control Panel: User CP, Settings & Options, Edit Ignore List. Then, type their name into the empty text box and click 'Okay'.

People do quote from posts though. Not in this case, admittedly.

If you want to do a more modern Banat Maazin style costume, wear a tight dress with paillettes, head scarf, and very tall disco heels. I don’t know if this is still in fashion today, but this is what Saqra described as the Ghawazee costume when I took a workshop with her a year ago. Saqra said that the Banat Maazin family is always changing its style once other people start to copy them so they can stay unique.



Here is a video clip I found on YouTube that's similar to what Saqra showed us.

When I saw the Banat Maazin in 1988, they humored us by wearing their traditional costumes with crowns, but then changed into paillette dresses like these, which they thought were more glamorous. Hmm, maybe this very same dress... I'll have to check my pix.

The Ghawazee coat-style costume has become, at least in my mind, more of a fakelore thing than serious attempt at cultural representation

I think that makes it very clear what you think, Tourbeau. You may well have seen tribal dancers who use the coat style for their own routines. That does not mean that every dancer on your side of the pond is and it certainly doesn't on ours. I do dance tribal..in this case we were dancing to Ghawazee music(which of course FCBD do) and we had studied the moves as I said. No way did we claim to be authentically accurate as I don't think anyone has a recording of the music from any time in the 19th century. But neither were we dancing any kind of fusion and we were not the first in the UK to do homage to the Ghawazee in history nor will we be the last.

You seem very happy to jump to the conclusion that we not making every effort to reproduce the Ghawazees in some measure. You made a very direct link with your post with my posting of the photo of the coats and then on to performances you have seen and not een happy with.
We aren't stupid enough to think we gave anymore than a theatrical reproduction with costumes made from modern materials (we weren't re-enactors..just actor/dancers) and we are far to old anyway to be little Ghawazee girls so you'll have to forgive the unauthentic wrinkles as well.

My advice to the OP is not to be overly concerned by the issues that have been brought up. If you want to try recreate what the Ghawazee did, there are different levels you can do this on but there are specialist teachers, there are the dancers on film, there are various costumes over the centuries you can try to reproduce. If you like the bloomers and coat..the coat was often a shorter version and then there is a move into dresses like the ones in the clips and also earlier ones in Aisha Ali's films. The field recording are also readily available.
From what I gather the coats,blouses and trousers were a version of what Egyptian women wore at the time.

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgur...1t:429,r:0,s:0



http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgur...w=1259&bih=512


You can go straight to source

Originally Posted by bintbeled

When I saw the Banat Maazin in 1988, they humored us by wearing their traditional costumes with crowns, but then changed into paillette dresses like these, which they thought were more glamorous. Hmm, maybe this very same dress... I'll have to check my pix.

Apparently when Khairiyya Mazin was invited to the IBCC this year, she got a new traditional costume made SPECIALLY (and then got stuck at home due to Stupid Icelandic Volcano Ash).

But the disco ball paillette dresses are good! And you can wear a taj. The only downside to discoball paillette compared to Mazin-style, or a coat for that matter, is that they are sleeveless and if your dancers are at all mature, they might like to have their upper arms covered.

It is a true fact in my view that while making a ghawazee coat takes some time, the 19th century look is an easier one to pull together and you get the benefit, if you make nice ones, of getting a pretty coverup out of the deal as well.

What's a taj?

[QUOTE=nikkiraqs;784610]

Originally Posted by Tourbeau

"and there are dancers out there who really put a lot of careful research into creating historically consistent costumes, but in my experience, when a dancer walks on stage in a Ghawazee coat, it's more likely to be the sword-and-Solace fantasy recreation vibe than ...."

How many ghazwazee performances around the world have you seen personally then? How much "experience" exactly have you had?,m::

"I expect a higher standard of authenticity in presentation when someone wears the Banat Maazin style costume. "

Oh DO YOU NOW...sorry Tourbeau you upset a lot of Bhuzzers including me in one of your posts before Bhuz went offline, just so we know WHO ARE *YOU* to say you expect a higher standard of authenticity in presentation? Are you one of the Maazin sisters or was you a Ghawazee in a past life?

I'm really quite fed up with your "Know it all" attitude and posts slagging off your fellow dance sisters calling them rag tag dancers in mismatched costumes when *you*haven't got the decency to even have a public photo of yourself. You are always writing posts in a tone of authority, so unless you're prepared to show yourself and tell us just where you got your "experience" from and HOW LONG YOU HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN BELLYDANCE then please stop touting yourself as the font of all ME dance knowledge.

Originally Posted by Karnak

What's a taj?

Yes, ditto, I want to know too please!

Originally Posted by tigerb

Yes, ditto, I want to know too please!

From the (third) Gilded Serpent link Tourbeau posted:
"taj (Arabic for "crown"), the rolled, stuffed and bejeweled crescent diadem which so artfully set off the face while keeping back the hair. Su'ad claimed that the taj had been designed by the Banat Mazin as a substitute for the mandil, the ubiquitous head covering of the Egyptian village woman, which the ghaziyyas had formerly worn. The mandil was a light-weight triangular scarf edged with little pom-poms or beaded crochet-work which, artfully wrapped and gathered with the ends tied rather forward on the head, formed a tiara-like silhouette."

IIRC Sahra reported that the Banat Maazin wore knee length skirts with lots of fringe on it over s stuffed bumroll. (You take a stocking. stuff it with batting, wrap it around your hips. Put skirt on over this.) The bumroll would allow more swing on the upward 3/4 shimmies.

Aisha Ali spent time with the Banat Maazin. Rumor has it that while she was there, in order to blend in with the crowd better, she wore sparkly Abaya's. Which the Banat Maazin liked so much, they adapted, leading to the paillette dresses as seen in the video posted.

As Liz pointed out, the more historic look is the coat with the various layers. I happen to like all three.

{{{HUGS}}}

Hi Liz,
I love the coats. Can you tell me where you got the pattern for them please.

They were made for us by dancer and designer Bev Smith of Leeds UK.
www.bevbellydance.co.uk
Sorry, we are not that talented...g.:
there are patterns about.

I do have one somewhere though..if you'd like it I can dig it out and see what we can arrange.

Here's an old thread discussing the three main coat patterns on the market http://www.bhuz.com/showthread.php?4...-coat-patterns.

I like all these theories about how Khairiyya started to wear the paillette dresses. One thing that she mentioned to Habiba and I a few years ago was how, as the sisters got older and danced less and less (and she being the only one still dancing for some time now), they *ahem* spread out a big with age.

Also, they sold the older costumes with the bustle and crown when times were tight - Habiba owns at least one. I think they replaced them with cheaper, easier to find dresses as age and economics came into play as well as other reasons listed here.

Hi Liza,
I'd definitely be interested as long as it's not the Madame X pattern. That was an absolute nightmare.,f::

Originally Posted by lizajuk

They were made for us by dancer and designer Bev Smith of Leeds UK.
www.bevbellydance.co.uk
Sorry, we are not that talented...g.:
there are patterns about.

I do have one somewhere though..if you'd like it I can dig it out and see what we can arrange.

Originally Posted by gloworm25

Hi Liza,
I'd definitely be interested as long as it's not the Madame X pattern. That was an absolute nightmare.,f::

This one is decent. . .

Al-Zahra's Ghawazee Coat

You can get it here: http://www.artemisimports.com/patterns/

Also, Folkwear's Turkish Dancer (http://www.folkwear.com/108.html) is somewhat adaptable.

{{{HUGS}}}

I remember Sahra noting that both the knee-length skirts and the paillette dresses were done with horizontal strips of fringe, as this was a hallmark of (Mazin style?) Ghawazee (it accentuated their movements much more than typical costume adornments).

Thanks for telling us what a taj is. I tried looking it up, but I kept getting results for the Taj Mahal!

Originally Posted by tahiradancer

This one is decent. . . Al-Zahra's Ghawazee Coat

You can get it here: http://www.artemisimports.com/patterns/

And it's not too bad to adjust; I had to go up about 3 sizes on it.