Thread: Vent about class frustrations.

So I've been taking classes wednesday nights at this dance school for about 8 months, and up until recently I thought it was the greatest thing ever. I love my class, the studio, the other girls, the teachers, but... I feel like I'm totally held back in that class.

We've been working on this certain move for about 5 weeks. I picked up the move after about 2 classes and was cool with it and ready to move on and learn more, however, the other people in my class are still struggling with it. We keep drilling the move over and over week after week. Its gotten so old... I kind of feel bad because the other people look at me doing it and I feel like they think I'm trying to be a showoff or something. Its not just the one move either, I pick up everything faster. And its not like I can just be put in a more advanced class because the school has this curriculum thing where you have to learn every move in a certain order.

I dunno, I'm just kind of frustrated because I really love dancing and I really want to learn more and drilling this move over and over is getting really boring and I'm afraid the other women in the class are developing some kind of animosity towards me. I know something I love should not cause me stress or anxiety like this.

I have another class on monday night at another studio as well and I absolutely ADORE the teacher, but again I pick up the moves faster and easier than the other students. Also theres a guy in that class and he really creeps me out but obviously I can't say anything about it. That would be pretty out of line.

Basicly, I feel out of place in my classes and I'm not sure what to do. Maybe I'm agonizing over this way too much and blowing it outta proportion. I'm thinking I might drop the wednesday class and take private lessons with my monday teacher. I just don't want to come off as an arrogant jerk or anything though, because I'm not.

Taking privates seems like a good idea for someone in your situation.

Also, every dancer can benefit from drilling the basics. If you're comfortable with the movement, see if you can do it with a more lifted posture, with more relaxed shoulders, with more graceful hand and arm placement, with more crispness, with more fluidity, more isolated, less isolated, etc. What head placement looks best with it? Can you do it with your weight on the left foot? How about the right? There are all sorts of subtle ways to improve/perfect the basics while they're being taught.

Still, drilling one movement for five weeks sounds like a real head-banger. Are you doing that one movement for the entire class period and nothing else??? That wouldn't be fun for anyone I'd think.

Are both your teachers with this same program with the rules about moving up?

I think you should talk to your teacher(s). She has no doubt noticed that you're picking up quickly, and if she knows you're willing to do even a couple of privates, she may be able to bring you up into the appropriate level a little faster. If not, consider it 'paying your dues' and maybe supplement your classes with videos and workshops.

Originally Posted by Lauren_

Taking privates seems like a good idea for someone in your situation.

I was just thinking the same thing!

Ditto on talking to your teacher. She (I would guess it's a she) may be able to give you some additional nuances to add to the movements--adding arm/hands, improving your posture, etc., that you can do to increase the learning curve a bit.

I was in your shoes a LOT when I started out. I felt like I could egyptian walk in 2 minutes while the rest of the class was unable to step on the doum after 2 weeks--but nobody likes a showoff, so I just found other dance outlets on my own through bhuz, videos, workshops, etc.

I'm kind of afraid to talk to my wednesday teacher about the issue. I'm afraid I'll come off sounding like an arrogant little twerp and end up making a complete ass of myself.

Did you find these other outlets instead of your regular class or in addition to?

My monday teacher is completely different. I love how she does everything. She's an awesome teacher and an amazing dancer and a really cool person. I don't mind being showoffy in that class. The only problem with that class is the creepy guy. I feel kinda bad about it but he really weirds me out. You ever meet someone that you really get gross nasty bad vibes from?

Originally Posted by _Kepi_

I'm kind of afraid to talk to my wednesday teacher about the issue. I'm afraid I'll come off sounding like an arrogant little twerp and end up making a complete ass of myself.

How does inquiring about private lessons equate to being an arrogant little twerp?

How much individual correction and comments do these teachers give during class? If you are going to spend your time and money on privates, you want to be sure it is with a teacher who is going to be worth your while.

If you have one teacher you think "gets" you, then I'd leave Wednesday teacher's class as it is. You don't want to look like God's gift to belly dance. If you're getting the moves, your teacher should be suggesting things you can do to build on those moves while the other students are working on the basic level moves.

The other outlets were in addition to my classes. I bought a ton of videos, watched as many video clips as I could. Improv danced at home...I just ate up belly dance. I still kind of do...even though I've been on a bit of a dance hiatus.

Creepy guy...stay away, make no conversation.

It will never get better if you're afraid to speak with your teacher. Talk to her privately, when no other student is there. Finding the right time can be difficult I find, too. I know that feeling. You want to speak with the teacher and every other student runs up to grab her attention too. I agree with Lauren, also. Private lessons could be a nice alternative. And could you request to have your Monday teacher more often or simply take her class on another day too, since you seem to enjoy her environment more (with the exception of the creepy guy)? Not sure how your work schedule is, but just a thought.

I hope it works out for you!


Just curious, what makes this creepy guy so creepy/weird?

I second, third speaking to your teacher. As a teacher, it's frustrating as all hell when people drop out and you have no idea why...especially if it was for something you could fix! If you can't get to talk to her at class due to time pressure, ask her if you can ring or email during the week. As a teacher, I know that some students want to progress very quickly, even if they haven't got everything 100%. Other students want to drill and get everything perfect before moving on. The problem is, they don't come with signs on their foreheads explaining this. I can only tell who's who if someone talks to me.

So, try talking to your teacher...and if you feel it's a sensitive thing, do it at a time when your classmates aren't there. There may be options - adding nuances, arms, layering; taking both your current level and the next level up concurrently for a term, so you get a challenge plus 'pass' your current level; privates. If she knows how frustrated you, and perhaps other students are, she may even move on to other moves.

Tell your teacher about the creepy guy.
And ask your class mates if they feel the same.
What if EVERYBODY in the class thinks he's weird and nobody speaks up? Your teacher will think that you all like him!

Anyway, the key to all your problems here is COMMUNICATION!

Often problems will work out surprisingly easy if you just TALK about them. As long as you shut up, nothing will change.

Good luck

MEISSOUN

Kepi,

Drill is an important part of dance training and maintenance, regardless of how long you have been dancing. While you might feel bored with the repetition every week, think of it as physical training. Depending on the move, you can challenge yourself by making it softer or crisper, increase the range of motion, concentrate on the muscles initiating and driving the movement, make the movement match the music, work on transition into and out of the movement. You can do all those things in class to push yourself while other class members are getting more competent as well.

What we feel inside shows on the outside. If you are bored or feel that the movements in the class are just too simple, that is more likely to lead to other students thinking you are being a showoff. But if you concentrate on improving the movements (even though you already know them) your interest in what you are doing will show on your face.

In addition to private lessons here and there, you could also go to some workshops and purchase some good instructional videos. If your instructors have not started you on them yet, learn to play zills. Zilling and dancing will give you a new appreciation of drills!

Good luck....Souzan

I understand about drilling, but I can also sympathise about boring teachers and this is not something you can fix. continually practising the same move (or routine) can be counter productive.

My first teacher taugt us the same routine for the entire 20 week class. In little pieces. I was so bored that I couldn't do the routine at the end show because I hadn't learnt it - it just hadn't gone in as a whole routine.

How is your teacher on explanatoin. this same teacher told me she didn't think that beginners wanted too much technique when I asked her about teaching posture. Yet I saw people practising endlessly trying to shimmy for example and I thought If she would only tell the woman how to stand she would free up her hips. But no, it was just keep on practising until you get it. But at least it wouldn't be the same move each week, we mixed them up a bit. It often is good for you to go back and revisit an earlier move so that you can see how you have progressed and then you may be inspired with new move.


My new teacher if we are getting mixed up in a routine laughs at us and makes us do something completely different then goes back at the end of the evening and wow we get it right. We dance 5 or 6 different dances in one evening, old and new, so although we started in September learning routines for July, class is never boring.

I persevered with the first teacher, and indeed it wasn't until I found a new teacher, that I realised what exactly I didn't like about the first.

So, how do you feel about the teacher. Many of the ideas given above are very good, but difficult for a newbie without feedback from a teacher. You at least have another teacher to compare. Sit down and work out what you like and don't like about both teachers. By all means speak to Wed teacher, about feeling you need more of a challenge, ask her how she feels you are doing first.

another suggestion some teachers will give you extra correction if you let them know that you are keen to progress. I ended up in the beginners of a local dancer, (various reasons) and she corrects me much more than the others as she knows that I am serious and that I have been dancing longer than that.

Fnially, if you do decide to leave, you will have to replace the drilling. apparently Rachel Brice does 50 chest lifts every day, amongst loads of other things, so the drilling is good for you, although you will need to decide if the class itself is any good.

Best speak to your teacher outside class time - don't hang around after class - ask if you can ring her.

First, check with her if you are doing the moves correctly. (It is possible that she is building control and stamina - I have had students who "get" a move very quickly but loose it after a couple of minutes drilling).

Next, if you are, ask what extensions you could do. If she's at a loss, here are some possibilities - depending on the move - level changes; direction changes; playing with the timing; layering - shimmies, undulations, travelling steps, zills, veil, balancing; changing the arms; combinations of the previous.

If you work out a plan before class and you take yourself off to the side you should limit the hassle from the other students.

Good luck.

Hey Kepi

As others have said here, drilling is an integral and inescapable part of learning the dance. Many teachers will insist on or at least encourage their 'advanced' and 'improver' students to drill with their beginners. Sure this can sometimes be monotonous (we've all been there) but I now welcome it as a bit of an opportunity to do some thinking about the move in terms of where I'm driving it from (am I really using all of the correct muscle groups etc?) and also how to develop it (hey, maybe it would be cute if I combined it with this/layered it this way).

The other thing about drills is that they really do help build muscle memory. Over the years, I have a few complete 'blank outs' on several moves and I've also had to recover from one major injury. Drilling really does help to combat those problems.

On the other hand, I've been in a similar situation to you. A while back, one of the local teachers lost a whole load of her students who had been dancing for a good few years. This was because she was teaching a mixed ability class and at the beginning she would tell the old hands to 'just put a shimmy on it' and then totally ignore us for the rest of the class. Eventually, some of us tried to negotiate a bit more input with her (like how do you put a shimmy on everything?) but she really wasn't interested in tweaking things even a tiny bit so a lot of people left the class.

I'd suggest that you tactfully approach your teacher but also maybe get some instructional DVDs to play around with at home. That way you can quietly extend your knowledge outside class.

I can understand your position, I am in a kind of similar position, but of my own choosing!

My BD learning has been a bit of a disjointed mess of mixed ability classes, workshops and DVDs. I decided to enrol on the beginner course with my teacher, because although I can do all the movements she is teaching on the course, I felt it was necessary to really polish my technique with proper feedback, and build up strength before attempting the intermediate classes. I practice every day, either for a 30-60 minute video or 10-15 mins of drills.

As a result I know exactly how you feel! It is almost embarrassing to "get" a movements while all around are struggling, especially if they question you about it - it's hard to briefly explain that you have more experience and work very hard at your dancing without sounding arrogant or putting them down unintentionally.

How I get past it: 1) my teacher does a mixed ability class in a neighbouring town, which is not as hard as the intermediate, but more challenging than the beginner - I see my beginner class as a drills and technique class. My teacher also goes around all the students during the class, and if she thinks I have the move perfectly she will introduce a variation, like travelling with it, or combining it with other moves. I also do zills, I think that will come in as a huge advantage later, and I am working on using arm movements along with my drills.

That said, the beginner course is just 8 weeks, I am not sure how I would feel if I knew it was a perpetual thing.

Everyone else has given such good advice, I only have one thing to add. If your instructor's approach is such that you feel uncomfortable approaching her privately for advice, my thought it that she's not a good fit as someone to take you to the next level in dancing. I personally find it very difficult to learn from someone if I can't ask for suggestions on how to improve - I find that being able to communicate with an instructor is vital to my growth.

I would also suggest talking to the other instructor about the creepy guy, but please be able to give her somewhat concrete examples of why he makes you uncomfortable. If she feels the need to address this with him, she has to talk about what *behaviors* are making some students uncomfortable so he can try to avoid doing them. It's one thing to say, "Some of the students are concerned that you seem to be watching your classmates in the mirror a little more frequently than necessary." It's another to say, "You're creeping people out. Stop being so creepy."

Originally Posted by laura 2

"You're creeping people out. Stop being so creepy."

..l;, For some reason, this is striking me as HILARIOUS right now. *cue ridiculous laughter*

wow. I'm surprised at the huge amount of response I've gotten. I went to class tonight with what you all have said in mind. Drilling is boring but its important.

I kind of think that my instructors knew what I was thinking because I got more individual instruction tonight than I had in a while. She gave me more pointers on my posture, arm position, and foot placement etc. It was more fun.

I think I'll see how next week goes and maybe after class I'll say something to my teacher. I know she really likes me and wouldn't want me to quit.

As for the creepy guy, I may just have to endure him. I feel like I'm probably beeing overly judgemental. There isn't any reason that I can pinpoint on excatly why he's creepy. Just his body language is weird, the way he carries himself, the way he stands, the way his face doesn't move at all and he always seems to be staring blankly into space. Also I've tried to talk to him several times and he's barely capable of forming a coherent sentence.

Originally Posted by _Kepi_

As for the creepy guy, I may just have to endure him. I feel like I'm probably beeing overly judgemental. There isn't any reason that I can pinpoint on excatly why he's creepy. Just his body language is weird, the way he carries himself, the way he stands, the way his face doesn't move at all and he always seems to be staring blankly into space. Also I've tried to talk to him several times and he's barely capable of forming a coherent sentence.

Hmm... It's possible (but impossible to know without asking or learning somehow indirectly, and either of those are dubious) that he has a minor developmental disability. I used to work with people who have developmental disabilities, at a day center, and some of them "seemed" creepy for a lot of the reasons you mention, until you found out that it was just that they really couldn't communicate the ways we take for granted (facial expression, body posture, coherent sentences, etc.). Then, it was all about finding out how they *did* communicate: suddenly, they didn't seem creepy anymore. As I said, there's probably no way you could find out about this, but if he's not doing anything outwardly creepy, it might make it easier to think of it in terms of conflicting methods of communicating, and see if that makes it less uncomfortable to share dance space. I'm not suggesting going out into a deserted alley or anything risky, but if you could get to know him through unconventional communication, it might make both of you more comfortable.

That said, there've been people who've -felt- creepy to me, and that's completely different. In that case, I'd trust your intuition. If you have a kind of skin-crawling *tangible* sensation, and not just a mental discomfort (not sure how to phrase this, but it's kind of like culture shock), then it's probably to be trusted. You still might want to talk to the teacher: maybe she knows why he is acting the way he is and can help you become more at ease in the situation.

I second Varuza - maybe he has Asperger's maybe he's shy, or both. If he's not creeping yuo out by paying too much attention, or looking too hard try to get over it.
My uncle had one wall eye and spoke slow and funny. The way my mother talked about strange men made me scared of him. Thing is he wouldn't hurt a fly and he was her own brother. I don't think she realised what she said though

I'm repeating what some say
1. Drilling is inevitable and if you want to be sure of your technique, you do it but of course as a more confident dancer,your teacher can expect you to layer and level etc. So others are watching you, they may be envious, admiring that's their problem. They SHOULD be concentrating on their own moves!
2. Loads of choreos.... oooer it is better to get one right and most classes want to feel they can put moves togther in one but it shouldn't take up that much of a class.
3.Creepy guy..yes he may be a perv but on the other hand it may be you girls are always watching him and the poor guy is nervous himself. If he's sincere you should all be supporting him. Unless you know he is a perv ,treat him like any other student ( although he may not need to know which tampon you reccommend!) and maybe he will relax a little and look less awkward.
Let's face it, he wants to learn a dance that generally ( not always) comes more easily to women.
AND believe me I have been to classes and workshops were a woman has freaked me out!

Originally Posted by _Kepi_

I'm kind of afraid to talk to my wednesday teacher about the issue. I'm afraid I'll come off sounding like an arrogant little twerp and end up making a complete ass of myself.

Did you find these other outlets instead of your regular class or in addition to?

My monday teacher is completely different. I love how she does everything. She's an awesome teacher and an amazing dancer and a really cool person. I don't mind being showoffy in that class. The only problem with that class is the creepy guy. I feel kinda bad about it but he really weirds me out. You ever meet someone that you really get gross nasty bad vibes from?

Could be the creepy guy is just in thrall of your dancing. Everybody has different levels of learning ability and you obviously pick things up quickly. It's my bet you could pick things up just from watching film footage... So, get yourself learning stuff from top dancers like Randa or Fifi. If the Wed class is too slow move on. It's as simple as that.

Originally Posted by _Kepi_

wow. I'm surprised at the huge amount of response I've gotten. I went to class tonight with what you all have said in mind. Drilling is boring but its important.

I kind of think that my instructors knew what I was thinking because I got more individual instruction tonight than I had in a while. She gave me more pointers on my posture, arm position, and foot placement etc. It was more fun.

I think I'll see how next week goes and maybe after class I'll say something to my teacher. I know she really likes me and wouldn't want me to quit.

As for the creepy guy, I may just have to endure him. I feel like I'm probably beeing overly judgemental. There isn't any reason that I can pinpoint on excatly why he's creepy. Just his body language is weird, the way he carries himself, the way he stands, the way his face doesn't move at all and he always seems to be staring blankly into space. Also I've tried to talk to him several times and he's barely capable of forming a coherent sentence.

Creepy guy probably feels a bit ill-at-ease in a class with women. He might be incredibly shy. Heck, he might have had a brain injury and is taking the class for rehab. There could be lots of things. Try just saying hello to him and every other student before class with a light and friendly smile. What you do is model on your body what a secure and happy person looks like even if inside you are repulsed by him or worried by him. Your brain and emotions will follow. And it works on him as well. You just want to avoid being too personal and make sure that you smiling and saying hello to everyone. Chances are that there is nothing really dangerously creepy about him.

I work with a guy that has creeped me out for 20 years. Figured that I can't change him (he has OCD and probably Aspbergers) but I can change my attitude toward him.

Souzan

Originally Posted by lizajuk

AND believe me I have been to classes and workshops were a woman has freaked me out!

Yeah, sorry about that. ..g.:

I guess this is just a repeat of the advice already given but I am in the same situation as you with a twist. I have been dancing for over a year but doing it at home. When I finally had the time and money to take a class I was looking forward to getting some critique on what I had been doing at home so I signed up for a beginner class. I was floored the first day when I saw that the class had about 55 students in it. I realized that I was not going to get the one-on-one direction that I was hoping for with that many students in the class. Of course I know most of the moves being taught but it has opened me up to a couple of things that I just wasn't getting at home such as improving and actually dancing in front of other people. I will definitly take a different class next go around but I am trying to get what I can out of this one. I also am signing up for all the workshops I can find and afford and doing a lot of video work as well.

Whoa, 55 is a lot. The beginner class I go to has a cap of 20 students, and the mixed one often has less than 10.

Originally Posted by Linnyg

I was floored the first day when I saw that the class had about 55 students in it. I realized that I was not going to get the one-on-one direction that I was hoping for with that many students in the class.

Wow, 55 students in the class? My mind is boggled! I experimented for a while with accepting 30, and felt that that was too many to provide the level of attention I felt my students deserved, so I worked with the adult ed folks who sponsored my classes to offer two, each with a cap of 20 enrollment. Glad to hear you were able to discover some things of value in spite of the lack of individual attention!

Originally Posted by *Shira*

Wow, 55 students in the class? My mind is boggled! I experimented for a while with accepting 30, and felt that that was too many to provide the level of attention I felt my students deserved, so I worked with the adult ed folks who sponsored my classes to offer two, each with a cap of 20 enrollment. Glad to hear you were able to discover some things of value in spite of the lack of individual attention!

As of today I think that we have dwindled down to about 30 enrolled. I have just let the teacher know that I am taking the class for more than just neat dance club moves and I hang around at the end of the class and check in with her for a little feed back or to clarify things. She doesn't seem to mind me doing this. I am going to take a class at her studio this summer and she said that there are days that she has NO students there so I could get some really personal attention. I am really looking forward to that.

Originally Posted by *Shira*

Wow, 55 students in the class? My mind is boggled! I experimented for a while with accepting 30, and felt that that was too many to provide the level of attention I felt my students deserved, so I worked with the adult ed folks who sponsored my classes to offer two, each with a cap of 20 enrollment. Glad to hear you were able to discover some things of value in spite of the lack of individual attention!

I don't think 30 beginners in a class is really safe (I had to teach those sort of numbers while on contract and swore I'd not do it if I had a choice) - but 55! That is plain greedy. It is different if it is a workshop with a special teacher that experienced dancers would not normally have access to - but not a class for new dancers.

I totally agree but I think it is because it is being taught at a University for credit so I think that it is the University that sets the numbers not my teacher. I am really excited to get to learn with her this summer at her studio where she said that sometimes she has no students that show! One-on-one for real!