Thread: Rant: Class Politics (long)

Its not often I feel the need to rant on about the minutiae of what goes on in class but sometimes I think I'm going mad.

Here's the deal. My teacher is one of those personalities that everyone wants a piece of; she does tend to attract a buzzing crowd of fans. I have no problem with this, I primarily anxious to learn from her but I am also happy to exchange a few moments of chit chat if she initiates it. A couple of months ago she sought out my advice on something non-dance related because I happened to be the best person to ask. I answered her question and she mentioned to others that I had been helpful. Fine. Dandy.

So there's this particular other student in the class. She is pretty experienced and is also a qualified teacher so she sometimes subs for my main teacher if she is ill or can't teach for some reason. She is also very keen to let everyone else in the class know that she is the teachers 'best friend'. I have no idea or particular interest in whether or not this is true ,s:: but I do know that some other members of the class find her very territorial about the teacher.

So a couple of months back I took all my fragile courage in my hands and worked really hard at home and in class to do my first solo performance at a halfa. Not many people other knew I was going to do it and I didn't publicise it abroad, although of course my teacher knew. The performance was far from earth-shattering but I was so happy that I had beaten my confidence issues to achieve a personal goal and had had fun and improved my dancing a little along the way ..g.: . It wasn't a local hafla but in my next class after my performance the 'Teachers Friend' asked me how it went and I said 'It went well, a lot better than I expected' to which she replied, and I quote 'Really? Are you sure it went well?' .w.:

I really didn't know what to say to that so I ignored it and got on with my own thing...

Now, in class last night 'Teacher's Friend' announces that she is organising a hafla and needs some solo dancers for her performance slots. My teacher immediately suggests that our performance group does at least one number. She then says 'And I would suggest that Khadiya does a solo' (To place this in context the other class members -about 3 of them - who also do solos weren't there so there was only me to focus on). As soon as she said this 'Teacher's Friend' snapped her mouth shut and glared at everyone for the rest of class. ,r:;

I felt a bit awkward because I though I would like to do another solo 'Teacher's Friend's' hafla wouldn't be my first choice. However, I didn't want to seem ungracious or unhelpful after I have been put on the spot. So, at the end of class, I approached 'Teacher's Friend' and said 'If you would like me to do a solo, I would be happy to but its your hafla and your decision'. She replied 'Ok, I suppose, but you will probably do something that wont fit into the schedule'. I said that I was quite adaptable and left it at that.

Its all silliness and probably mostly my being oversensitive (though I know others have complained about her in similar circumstances) but this lady makes me feel uncomfortable and I don't look forward to the lessons where she subs. I go anyway because I wont let my dancing suffer but I really don't know how best to be around someone like this.

Normal service will now resume

I think teacher aught to be made aware that there are people in her class who make life uncomfortable for others.PM me
What she said about assessing your performance was out of order.

Ah, the green eyed monster lives! Jeez, could "teachers friend" be any more rude? That question was rhetorical.

Originally Posted by khadiya

Its not often I feel the need to rant on about the minutiae of what goes on in class but sometimes I think I'm going mad.

Here's the deal. My teacher is one of those personalities that everyone wants a piece of; she does tend to attract a buzzing crowd of fans. I have no problem with this, I primarily anxious to learn from her but I am also happy to exchange a few moments of chit chat if she initiates it. A couple of months ago she sought out my advice on something non-dance related because I happened to be the best person to ask. I answered her question and she mentioned to others that I had been helpful. Fine. Dandy.

So there's this particular other student in the class. She is pretty experienced and is also a qualified teacher so she sometimes subs for my main teacher if she is ill or can't teach for some reason. She is also very keen to let everyone else in the class know that she is the teachers 'best friend'. I have no idea or particular interest in whether or not this is true ,s:: but I do know that some other members of the class find her very territorial about the teacher.

So a couple of months back I took all my fragile courage in my hands and worked really hard at home and in class to do my first solo performance at a halfa. Not many people other knew I was going to do it and I didn't publicise it abroad, although of course my teacher knew. The performance was far from earth-shattering but I was so happy that I had beaten my confidence issues to achieve a personal goal and had had fun and improved my dancing a little along the way ..g.: . It wasn't a local hafla but in my next class after my performance the 'Teachers Friend' asked me how it went and I said 'It went well, a lot better than I expected' to which she replied, and I quote 'Really? Are you sure it went well?' .w.:

I really didn't know what to say to that so I ignored it and got on with my own thing...

Welcome to the world of Belly Dance. Wise to ignore. Doing own thing good. You know you're good when people start feeling threatened. If you were crap, she'd not be bothered. She's probably heard how good you were and has decided to work some psychology on you. So predictable. Don't let it get you down, coz it'll get worse. (bit of a jobes comforter here, but its true).

Originally Posted by blackcherry

Welcome to the world of Belly Dance. Wise to ignore. Doing own thing good. You know you're good when people start feeling threatened. If you were crap, she'd not be bothered. She's probably heard how good you were and has decided to work some psychology on you. So predictable. Don't let it get you down, coz it'll get worse. (bit of a jobes comforter here, but its true).

Bob on. This happens all the time, and believe me, it happens to the like of me. It's especially hateful when your just starting out and trying to build a bit of confidence and you really appreciate the input and feedback of others for confirmation of your budding skills. Don't be disheartened, just bear in mind that this person has her own insecurities and is obviously threated by you and this is one of the best barometers to how well your dancing is, albeit a not very nice one.

Hi

I'd just like to add a rider to my rant. Firstly, thank you so much everyone for your kind responses. I will reply to PMs shortly.

Secondly, Posting this on Bhuz was possibly not my best decision beacuse at least some members know both my teacher (who is an excellent tutor and with whom, I hasten to add, i have no problem at all) and the individual involved in the situations that make me uncomfortable. However, I did so out of pure frustration and also because bhuz has been a wonderful source of both information and support to me.

To clarify the situation slightly. It is only the very sensitive individuals in my class who seem to be upset by all this nonsense. Everyone else chugs along merrily. Having spoken with others about the situation we have all agreed that this is one of those times when any kind of speaking up or allowing oneself to get any further involved would be detrimental. Partly because of the personalities involved; partly because of issues such as 'who has been in the class longest' and 'who has a reputation as a troublemaker'; and partly because it is one of those times when you will only get covered in muck yourself.

90% of the time I can see this situation for the old cobblers it is but what upsets me the most is my own responses: despite trying super hard to be polite and to ignore this sort of thing, I still end up feeling upset and dirty and weak.

that is all

Khadiyah, you may not be able to change this person's behavior, but you can change how you react to it. If you're "feeling upset and dirty and weak," she has accomplished her mission -- making herself feel good while tearing you down. It's easier said than done, but can you just accept the fact that she will continue to try to make you feel bad, but decide, for yourself, that you will just rise above it and not let it bother you?

Originally Posted by khadiya

Hi

I'd just like to add a rider to my rant. Firstly, thank you so much everyone for your kind responses. I will reply to PMs shortly.

Secondly, Posting this on Bhuz was possibly not my best decision beacuse at least some members know both my teacher (who is an excellent tutor and with whom, I hasten to add, i have no problem at all) and the individual involved in the situations that make me uncomfortable. However, I did so out of pure frustration and also because bhuz has been a wonderful source of both information and support to me.

To clarify the situation slightly. It is only the very sensitive individuals in my class who seem to be upset by all this nonsense. Everyone else chugs along merrily. Having spoken with others about the situation we have all agreed that this is one of those times when any kind of speaking up or allowing oneself to get any further involved would be detrimental. Partly because of the personalities involved; partly because of issues such as 'who has been in the class longest' and 'who has a reputation as a troublemaker'; and partly because it is one of those times when you will only get covered in muck yourself.

90% of the time I can see this situation for the old cobblers it is but what upsets me the most is my own responses: despite trying super hard to be polite and to ignore this sort of thing, I still end up feeling upset and dirty and weak.

that is all

You see, that's where men differ from women. Guys would just slug each other and that's an end to it. You feel upset dirty and weak coz you've not expressed yourself. Your holding back. It might not be PC but that dame should have been dealt with in the way she deserved. Nipped in the bud, so to speak. when she asked, "Are you sure?" I'd've said, "Sure I'm sure, why you got a problem with that, sister?"

she'd have said, "Er, no."

You say, "Well, what's your point?"

She says "I didn't mean anything by it I was thinking out loud..."

You say, "Are you thinking what I'm thinking that I think that you're thinking I'm thinking because if you think that I think what I think I'm thinking then we've got a problem?

At which point she scuttles off, nonplussed never to bother you again.

But if all that is too complicated, you could have just said "If I want your opinion, I'll read it in your entrails."

Originally Posted by blackcherry

"If I want your opinion, I'll read it in your entrails."

Harsh. Can't wait to use it! ..l;,

I agree "teacher's best friend" feels threatened. The teacher is giving you attention, thus taking attention away from her. I'm sorry you have to deal with this. I'm glad you are trying to not let her bring you down. Hugs.

Originally Posted by bintbeled

Khadiyah, you may not be able to change this person's behavior, but you can change how you react to it. If you're "feeling upset and dirty and weak," she has accomplished her mission -- making herself feel good while tearing you down. It's easier said than done, but can you just accept the fact that she will continue to try to make you feel bad, but decide, for yourself, that you will just rise above it and not let it bother you?

No. This is why the bully thrives. Tackle the bully, and the problem is solved. Bullies hate being confronted, they run a mile. Turning the other cheek and being all stiff upper lip just enables them to keep repeating the same bad behaviour. You may diffuse their attack, but you certainly won't stop them from bad mouthing you to others. If you get hold of them by the short and curlies, on the other hand, and give them a good swing around, chances are, they will back off and be too scared to provoke your wrath again.

But if all that is too complicated, you could have just said "If I want your opinion, I'll read it in your entrails."

..l;,

Ah, shades of my teenaged years when I still thought I might master the art of the snappy comeback!

You are quite right about men tending not to do this. The last male manipulator I met was a long time ago and his peers muttered about it slightly for a couple of weeks then threw an empty whisky bottle at him (I'm not saying it was the best solution but it did draw a line under things - the trouble with us gals is that we often let stuff drag on, all the while getting more poisonous).

I fear that Latifah is quite right and the art of the lofty ignore whilst staying on the moral high ground is the way forward but this can be a lonely path and sometimes I fall by the wayside.

Khadiya,

Just fluff your way up to her in class and sweetly say "I thought I'd better let you know that I won't be available to do a solo at your hafla as I have a booking for that night. Someone who SAW me perform at the hafla a while back has invited me to do an engagement party...and as it's a paying job, I took the offer."

Then merrily dance your way through class and don't forget to smile.

Many times when we react how you did is when we are caught off guard by catty remarks. Just remember, she has the problem....it's not yours unless you make it so.

hugs
Samiya
xxx

Turning the other cheek and being all stiff upper lip just enables them to keep repeating the same bad behaviour

This is also a good point. Not my forte, but a good point.

Just fluff your way up to her in class and sweetly say "I thought I'd better let you know that I won't be available to do a solo at your hafla as I have a booking for that night. Someone who SAW me perform at the hafla a while back has invited me to do an engagement party...and as it's a paying job, I took the offer

Interestingly Samiya. This is actually the case! Its not a paying job but I have been asked to do another performance on that date anyway so my plan was to quietly state that I have another engagement form some out of area dancers who asked me to do a slot.

I only remembered this after last night's class SIGH.

Well unless her hafla is before the next class period, you still have the opportunity to let her know (not in class itself but before or after class or during a water break) that you have been contracted for another performance (a job - it doesn't have to be a paying gig to be a "job") the night that her hafla is scheduled.

"I sure hate to let you down like this, but I will be unable to perform at your hafla (and reference the date either by actual date "on x" or by saying "this time") as I have been contracted for another performance on that date. I hope this doesn't cause you any problems with your scheduling."

And this should be delivered in all sweetness and light and sincerity (or at least as much so as your natural character will allow).

BTW - I'm also bad with thinking on my feet when slapped upside the head like that too. Even after 30 years of this, it still takes me by surprise. (Yeah, I'm the eternal optimist, just ask the husband.) ..g.:

If appropriate there's always..."Well I am only young so I've got plenty of time to improve!"

Originally Posted by blackcherry

But if all that is too complicated, you could have just said "If I want your opinion, I'll read it in your entrails."

Oh yeh... I'm going to file that one away. ..l;,

I hate manipulators! I was married to someone whose "gentle tyranny" was so subtle i only realized the scope of it once I was out from under.

Originally Posted by blackcherry

You see, that's where men differ from women. Guys would just slug each other and that's an end to it. You feel upset dirty and weak coz you've not expressed yourself. Your holding back. It might not be PC but that dame should have been dealt with in the way she deserved. Nipped in the bud, so to speak. when she asked, "Are you sure?" I'd've said, "Sure I'm sure, why you got a problem with that, sister?"

she'd have said, "Er, no."

You say, "Well, what's your point?"

She says "I didn't mean anything by it I was thinking out loud..."

You say, "Are you thinking what I'm thinking that I think that you're thinking I'm thinking because if you think that I think what I think I'm thinking then we've got a problem?

At which point she scuttles off, nonplussed never to bother you again.

But if all that is too complicated, you could have just said "If I want your opinion, I'll read it in your entrails."

Love this response. Saucy!

I am so sorry that this happened to you. Especially from someone who didn't even see you dance. My first was just for family and close friends. I had a couple of people who knew about my real insecurities stand close to those who I knew would be thinking awful things in their heads at least so that if they said even one thing that could be taken as rude they could grab them by the short hairs and give them a personal escort to their cars to go home. Although I knew that there were haters in the crowd, it helped to know that there were some that support me no matter what my weight and knew that this was my first up so they didn't expect a pro. I later found out that they actually warned them before hand what to expect if they were rude. Love the friends!

I would follow the advise of others and the next time you see her rub it in that you have a better opportunity and can't do her show. I am the queen of the snappy come back and according to my mother this gets me into trouble at times but people always know exactly where I stand!

Originally Posted by khadiya

This is also a good point. Not my forte, but a good point.

Deal with this insecure person once by standing up for yourself and then you probably won't ever have to deal with this again. She'll leave you alone. I work with a woman like this who tried this with me once and I confronted her immediately. She doesn't even TRY to push me around or make snide comments to me and we actually are now on pretty good terms.

I don't like the "I've got another gig" response (whether you do or not) because then it seems like you are just playing the "better than you" game with her rather than stopping the whole passive-aggressive nonsense in its tracks. It's better to confront her comments directly when they come up as blackcherry suggested.

I struggle with this stuff too, all the time!! Not just in dance interactions, of course. It's so much easier to see someone else's situation and say to myself, "well here's exactly what I'd recommend", but here it is: When people act like that, Mish is right, you have to nip it in the bud immediately. Don't reply with a "game". Be open, honest, sincere, but crystal clear. Doesn't mean she'll be open and sincere back, these types usually aren't. But she'll know where you stand and you'll feel better about yourself. I'd pull her aside and say: hey the other day your comment hurt my feelings. And reference the conversation. Explain why it hurt, give her an opportunity to apologize (maybe she will, likely she won't) - but make the main point very short and sweet - that what she said wasn't right and you'd appreciate her not saying stuff like that again.

She probably won't be honest and sincere back, even if you take her head on. But so what. Do the right thing always--and you'll never worry another moment about other people's passive-aggressive high school games.

I often use humor to take on those kinds comments--so the person knows I totally understood the underhanded comment and it doesn't have any power over me.

Or just throw a Jack Daniels bottle at her.

For example, this comment "I said 'It went well, a lot better than I expected' to which she replied, and I quote 'Really? Are you sure it went well?' "

I might have said, "WHAT!? Did my bad dancing get in the papers again? Seriously, did you hear that I sucked or something?"

Clearly, she's trying to imply that maybe you sucked...maybe you did, so effing what? You danced and you're learning. Her need to point it out to you says a lot about her and nothing about you. Insecurity--her problem.

oh I have dealt with ones like this. Yes - I am a very sensitive one too and really take everything to heart. This dance has taught me to be "tougher skinned" about people like this. No matter where I go and who I dance with, there is always going to be that one person who "dislikes me". No matter how friendly I am to everyone - she will still dislike me.

Personally, I have found that people like this are truly "threatened" by you. Maybe you teacher ranted about how great your solo was to this chick. maybe your teacher has ranted about how well you have come along to her.

Women like "teacher's pet" are deep down insecure with themselves.

They are threatened by the fact that you are confident. That you are dedicated. That you are attractive. All the above apply.

As hard as it may be - walk into class confident. Perform in her hafla flawlessly. Do not show her that she is bothering you. That is where she gains her power.

Sounds odd and juvenile but oh so true...

If being direct isn't your style, what about replying with a question? Sort of like what Mish said above. When someone says a comment or question with an obviously snide intention, I always answer with an expression of genuine interest on my face with, "What do you mean?" This puts the turd right back in their pocket and you don't ever have to think of a snappy comeback (or at least it buys you some time to come up with one ;) Eye contact is key here. It speaks volumes

Originally Posted by HOOKEDNOVICE

If being direct isn't your style, what about replying with a question? Sort of like what Mish said above. When someone says a comment or question with an obviously snide intention, I always answer with an expression of genuine interest on my face with, "What do you mean?" This puts the turd right back in their pocket and you don't ever have to think of a snappy comeback (or at least it buys you some time to come up with one ;) Eye contact is key here. It speaks volumes

This is more my style... just give her the look of "Did you really just say that?" with firm eye contact. People with questionable motives get really uncomfortable with eye contact -- it becomes sport almost to watch them wallow in their "she sees right thru' me" knowledge without having to say anything.

exactly!!

I find another good response is "You'll have to run that by me one more time, I don't quite catch your meaning"