Thread: In a bit of a quandry...

I've been reading through a lot of posts lately, especially the ones about pro vs. non-pro and what not. My question is, how can I get to the pro level?

A little bit of background, I've been dancing for 3 years. Unfortunately, I have not had a lot of formal training, so I know I'm definitely not pro level (or even close). Most of my teachers have been women who are good dancers themselves, but usually very new to teaching (with the exception of my first teacher who was advertising herself as a pro after 6 months of classes). There are a couple of options for teachers in my area, but most of them teach at the beginner level and more for hobbyists and women looking to get some fun exercise.

I do use a lot of videos, but I know that will only get me so far. What can I do with limited resources in my hometown? The closest large city to me is Austin, TX. I'm assuming some teachers offer private lessons. Is that something I should look into? I love performing, and that's primarily what I want to do. I have no desire to ever teach, simply because I don't think I'm a very good teacher.

Anyway, thanks all for reading this. I look forward to reading the responses! :)

Private lessons is perhaps the fastest track to really improve your dancing, even if you could only take a private once or twice a month and then spend lots of time working on whatever you had in the class. Some instructors will let you videotape your private lesson, so you can go home and work.

I don't know much about the Austin scene, are there workshops and things there? Workshops are a great way to try out a variety of styles and learn how different instructors 'hear' the music. And workshop shows are a great way to be exposed to lots of live dancing, which is also really important!

Private lessons with a good teacher are worth every penny. Even if it means driving a couple hours each way 1-2 times a month, you won't regret it. You must dedicate yourself to actually practicing the material, however. And use the driving time to listen to dance music over and over and over. (Isn't Bahaia in Austin? That means you have access to a GREAT teacher/performer! Oh, and Lily and Stacey Lizzette, whom I saw perform recently in Orlando, as well as Bahaia, are also Bhuzzers who are in Austin. They were both gorgeous dancers.)

How far away is Austin? I attend classes as little as once a month because of the drive time, and work individually outside that. My instructor understands, and it still beats the heck out of nothing at all!

Hi Sariah:

I think that private lessons really play an important role in progressing to the advanced levels. Find a good teacher in Austin who is experienced, has expertise in the style you want to learn, and will work with you privately to set and achieve goals. If you have decent fundamental technique, you might be able to work 1-2 times per month with a teacher and make excellent progress.

Also, don't immediately discount the local teachers just because their classes are geared mostly for recreation. That may be dictated by their students, not their abilities. You might see if of one these teachers would be willing to work privately with you to help you advance.

Workshops are important too, but workshops alone don't really advance your performing skills. You generally get no feedback, correction, or much time for assimilation.

Also, get a video camera and record your dancing, then study it over and over again.

In terms of other videos, make sure you are studying performances and not just instructional material.

Well, I'm hoping to make it to 3rd Coast in January, but due to some unforeseen circumstances, I may not be able to go. However, I do think there are workshops held every so often in Austin.

I do worry that my dancing will become stagnant. Even if I never actually go "pro", I still would love to persue being the best dancer I possibly can.

Oops, you are all too quick for me! lol

Austin is about an hour or so away, so definitely doable 1 or 2 times a month.

I've talked a bit with my favorite teacher in town, but she pretty much is strictly wanting to teach for recreation. My second teacher, who was a great dancer, unfortunately fell into some legal trouble, and I'm not sure what happened to her.

Oh, and I'll also mention that I just recently started studying more performances rather than just instructionals.

Here is a video taken of a performance I did a couple of months ago, so y'all can kind of see where I'm at. Keep in mind this was my first ever bellydance performance...and believe, I see each and every mistake I made each time I watch it! :P We did more of a fusion style here, though I'd love to get into a more Egyptian style or Am Cab style.

I'm the one in the back row, short sleeves. I usually have a big ol' grin on my face. lol

Great question! I've been wondering the same thing, except I'm in Arkansas. I thought you did really well on the video, btw..g.:

Originally Posted by wayauwohali

Great question! I've been wondering the same thing, except I'm in Arkansas. I thought you did really well on the video, btw..g.:

Thank you! I was really nervous, and we had just finished the choreo a couple of days before. I almost hate watching because I cringe so much at my mistakes! lol

Originally Posted by kiyaana

Private lessons with a good teacher are worth every penny. Even if it means driving a couple hours each way 1-2 times a month, you won't regret it. You must dedicate yourself to actually practicing the material, however. And use the driving time to listen to dance music over and over and over. (Isn't Bahaia in Austin? That means you have access to a GREAT teacher/performer! Oh, and Lily and Stacey Lizzette, whom I saw perform recently in Orlando, as well as Bahaia, are also Bhuzzers who are in Austin. They were both gorgeous dancers.)

Find Bahaia and take classes with her. She is incredible and she rocks my socks as a person. I love that girl.

Originally Posted by mish_mish

Find Bahaia and take classes with her. She is incredible and she rocks my socks as a person. I love that girl.

That's who I've been considering. I've never met her in person, but I've seen clips of her dancing and I've heard wonderful things about her. Isn't she having her dance camp this weekend? I think I'll wait to contact her next week sometime, as I know she must be really busy right now.

She is probably really overwhelmed with camp--which is where I met her--but afterwards, check out one of her classes. I really enjoy her teaching style and I also love her dance style. She is just a lot of fun and knows her sh*t without being a diva. If you can get to camp, I recommend that, too.

I really wanted to try to go this year, but my hubby and I's 9th anniversary is this Friday. Since he was deployed last year at this time, I wanted to be able to celebrate with him. I hope to go next year if at all possible.

She does a lot of other events in Texas and she does a dance trip to Jamaica, so there are plenty of opportunities to meet her. I know anniversaries are special!

Oh, Jamaica would be amazing....that would take a lot of saving! (hey, that rhymes...)

Bahaia seems to get some great instructors at her events.

Jamaica me belly dance, Bahaia!

Any recommendations for the Arkansas area?..g.:

Ooops, should start different thread

Originally Posted by Sariah

Oops, you are all too quick for me! lol

Austin is about an hour or so away, so definitely doable 1 or 2 times a month.

You're an hour away from Bahaia? You're a lucky girl.

I live outside St. Louis...way outside. I've always had to drive a minimum of 45 minutes to class. I started out in a regular weekly class, then later added twice-monthly troupe practices onto that! Granted, gas was $1 a gallon at the time and I drive a Honda.

But my kids were 12 and 5 at the time, and I was running a business. Having a couple of hours each week alone with my thoughts = priceless!

Yeah, I truly wish gas wasn't so expensive. I miss the days when I could fill up my car with $15. Now it usually takes over $40.

Sariah,
It's great that you are online seeking out resources!!! I agree with what others have posted...get thee to a private lesson, even if it's only once a month. I watched your vid last night...you have a nice foundation as far as movement vocabulary, and a good stage presence. Private lessons will offer you targeted instruction to your specific needs/goals, and will help you to grow as a dancer. Good luck!

Nisaa

Thank you Nisaa. :)

Another question, when I do go for private lessons, what sorts of things should I focus on?

Originally Posted by Sariah

Yeah, I truly wish gas wasn't so expensive. I miss the days when I could fill up my car with $15. Now it usually takes over $40.

$40? That's nothing, here in the UK it costs me over £70 now (nearly $140)!

Sorry to threadjack, good luck with your dancing -lol!

Originally Posted by firefly5

$40? That's nothing, here in the UK it costs me over £70 now (nearly $140)!

Sorry to threadjack, good luck with your dancing -lol!

Yikes!!! My dad has a huge truck, with a hemi and all that, and it costs him well over $100 to fill it up. I'm thankful I have a little car!

Disclaimer: I'm just moving into the "pro" scene myself, so by no means am I an expert on the subject, but this is what I've gleaned from reading the many pro vs. hobbiest threads in the last little while, as well as the "who does she think she is?" threads, which give excellent insight into what professionals in this community expect of their peers... without further ado...

A few other things besides private classes, which a dancer needs to develop in order to "go pro":

- a many and varied repretoire of highly-developed skills, including contemporary Egyptian moves, folkloric (Saidi, Raks Asaya, etc...), taxim, drum solos, veil, etc...

- the ability to play zills. Not to every song. And not at every moment. But as a pro, one needs to recognize when zilling enhances the music and when it would annoy one's audience, and be able to play accordingly.

- the ability to improvise, both to "canned" music, and live musicians (where available). Choreographing an entire set is a start, but you need to be able to roll with the punches during live shows. This only comes from practice and experience but it's definitely something a pro should work on developing.

- an understanding of how costuming, hair and makeup can enhance or detract from one's performance. And a commitment to maintaining a stellar professional image with beautiful, well-made and well-kept costumes and star-quality hair and makeup which best flatters the dancer.

- musicality, which comes from learning about, studying and listening to Middle-Eastern music. A lot. And I mean A LOT! A pro should understand and be able to recognize the different rhythms (masmoudi, saidi, malfouf, etc...), know where they come from and how to dance to them. She should LOVE this music. It should pulsate within her. She shouldn't be able to sit still when hearing it.

Just as an aside: It occurs to me that this is one thing that someone who's been studing the dance for only a few months couldn't POSSIBLY develop in such a short time. There are literally thousands upon thousands of Middle-Eastern songs and I couldn't imagine that a dancer could absorb them into her system in a single year. I've been dancing for just over two years, devouring every piece of music I can get my hands on, and I've just barely scratched the surface... anyway, continuing on: [continued]

Originally Posted by Sariah

Yikes!!! My dad has a huge truck, with a hemi and all that, and it costs him well over $100 to fill it up. I'm thankful I have a little car!

But believe it or not I have a little car too, I filled up earlier this week, and the fuel cost me £1.21 a litre, that's £4.60 a gallon (about $8.80). Ouch.

- stage presence - otherwise known as the "it" factor. Unlike ballet or lyrical dance, which is sort of other-worldly and etherial, belly dance is for the people. For the audience. That being said, a professional belly dancer - especially one who plans to work in restaurants and private parties - needs to be able to connect directly to her audience in an instant. She needs to convey the fun, festive energy to them. She needs to get them excited to be there, hearing the music, feeling the beat. She needs to know how to "work the crowd", how to get them up and dancing with her.

- an understanding of how the dance community works, including standard rates and the importance of adhering to them. She must be committed to maintaining the highest standards of professionalism and class. She needs to develop an amicable professional practice wherein her colleagues respect her and she respects her colleagues. This will only serve her well during those times when she needs their support.

It's helpful to have a dance mentor who's been dancing professionally for a long time, who can help you to know the ins and outs of dealing with things like unruly audience members and dishonest clients. To teach you how to accept tips without looking cheap. And to give you constructive, honest feedback on how you're doing.

As to what to focus on during your private classes, these are all things an experienced professional can teach you.

Seasoned pros: I'm sure this isn't an exhaustive list... Did I forget anything?

I have had the opportunity to study with Bahaia and can tell you she is truly a great teacher, really knows her stuff, she is very and very down to earth.

The drive is worth it - I would even go as far as to suggest doing semi-private classes with Bahaia and get together a small (like 2 other dancers) group of students so you can carpool and share gas expenses. You still get good quality time cause of the very small number of people, but your expenses drop a bit.

As far as focusing on subjects during privates/semi-privates: Get out the videocamera and record yourself dancing at home to several different styles of music then take a look and critic yourself. If necessary, take the video with you and have the teacher look at it and make suggestions on what you need to sharpen, what you need to concentrate on and such.

I would continue with the video training. You can really pick up alot off videos. Be picky and ask around as far as who has the best instructional videos on specific genres or subjects.

Practice everyday - even if it is only to one song. It helps to make a schedule (Mon: Shimmies, Tue: Arms, etc....). Keep the practices short so you don't burn out. Add some ladies to the mix - have a few fellow students come over and work with each other on practicing. I have learned that learning how to really look at a dancer and critic (not criticize) makes you very aware of your own body as you dance.

Veritate - Wow! Thank you! I'm printing that off and putting it in my notebook.

Amaryllis - Excellent ideas. I wish I had some other ladies that would be interested, but most of my dance friends are doing it just for fun and exercise and probably wouldn't stick with going to Austin for very long.

And since you mentioned videos, do you have any suggestions for good ones? I have several already, but I'm always open to suggestions.

Oh, another thing:

- knowledge of "The Greats". It's not enough to know the skills, in my opinion. A professional dancer should know who has gone before her and what they did for the dance. This means watching hours and hours of performance video.

Sariah, you're welcome. Like I said, I'm not an expert on these things, but these are the standards I expect from myself as a pro and from those who I look to for guidance in the industry.