Thread: BD move: grinding fist into open hand

What is the significance of this move. I've seen dancers do this. They grind their fist, vertically onto the other hand, open palm. Does this mean something or is it just a cute little move to do?

An example is on this thread, see the video Imman is dancing to playing the Hamaki song:

http://www.bhuz.com/forum/rest-belly...ubery-wow.html

I didn't see the clip, but what you're describing is a Turkish move, from Romani (gypsy) dance. If I remember right, it's sort of a cooking gesture (grinding). The Romani gestures, for the most part, don't have meanings associated with them (or they choose not to share the meanings with us gadje, anyway).

Ha-ha, I can actually picture that they would be laughing at us for doing this move out of context - if that is the case. Thanks Lauren, I knew that was what it was, just thought I missed out on something new.

About ten years ago in a class, a teacher showed us that move and said it was a playful/smug type of gesture, along the lines of "I've got something you can't have"

But I don't know where she picked it up from or the cultural context. It was cute when she did it but I'm always wary of gestures :-)

I was told it was like rubbing salt in the wound ("Nanananana") by one teacher, and more like "boy, you're in for it" by another.

I saw leyla hadda doo this in her Melalah (sp) piece, and it definitely had the you-are-in-so-much-trouble feel to it.

{{{HUGS}}}

Oh, interesting. I've sent an email to Imman to ask her this very question. I will post the answer if she does not answer here first. Hopefully she will chime in.

I was told it was a "I've got one over you" type gesture from an Egyptian teacher.

i was taught a choreo that had this and im not sure but i think it was mahmoud reda and that he said it referred to "grinding poison"... and would be used in a song about love/jeaolousy

So many meanings ..l;, !

I was told that it's a grinding pepper gesture, and that it's used with a "Nananana" feeling, as Nasila said.

Originally Posted by sylvie_aziyade

So many meanings ..l;, !

I was told that it's a grinding pepper gesture, and that it's used with a "Nananana" feeling, as Nasila said.

This is pretty much what I was told by Diana Shahein in a saidi workshop. She said it means "Eat your heart out."

My Syrian teacher taught me that it means "Eat your heart out" or "get a load of THIS"

You can see this gesture here, in this Farid el Atrache/Samia Gamal video. It goes along with lyrics that talk about jealous people.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apwh0MIgGcY]YouTube - Egyptian - Samia Gamal and Farid - ya3awazel falfelo[/ame]

ETA: Woo hoo! I got six stars!

Originally Posted by tamrahennatx

You can see this gesture here, in this Farid el Atrache/Samia Gamal video. It goes along with lyrics that talk about jealous people.

YouTube - Egyptian - Samia Gamal and Farid - ya3awazel falfelo

ETA: Woo hoo! I got six stars!

Yes, from some Arabs, I've heard this gesture described as being related to anger/jealousy.

I took a looooooong work shop with Dhalia Carella and she said is was a Rom gesture for stirring the pot. That saying has a couple of meanings in English as well.

Originally Posted by Amber_moon

My Syrian teacher taught me that it means "Eat your heart out" or "get a load of THIS"

Azhia and I were in a workshop with Faten Salama, and she said that in the Middle East, it's an 'Eat your heart out" kind of thing.

I forget the exact words she used, it was something like "when something comes between you and someone else, and you want to say, take that" with some allusion of rubbing salt in the wounds too.

In Egypt, we use it as an "eat your heart out" gesture. Definitely smug..g.:

Yasmina Ramzy explained it as "stirring up the pot" (as in - causing trouble), which seems to follow suit with "eat your heart out".

So, it sounds as if it's SMUG no matter what else you attach to it, ie... jeaulosy, causing trouble, eat your heart out, I'm hot and your not, on and on......

I saw Leila Haddad do this gesture in a live performance when she was angry that people in the crowd were videotaping in spite of her express wishes that they not do so.

I think maybe the Turkish Rom gesture is something a little different, doesn't the arm make a circular movement (parallel to the floor) as well?

At a Leila (of Cairo) workshop, where she was teaching a melaya inspired dance, She taught this gesture "you're rubbing salt in my wound" (like a mortar and pestle grinds ; fist perpendicular to palm), meaning you were inflicting pain or heartache.

I'm not convinced it has anything to do with jealousy per se, but how the situation is making the "singer" or "dancer" feel. Like they are "unhappy" and "hurt" by what's being sung about. At least, that's the take I get when I see it used.

This is a good example of one thing meaning many things to different people.

I think the "stirring the pot" Turkish gesture is a bigger gesture. It's also a more direct (dramatic) representation of everyday activities, than a figurative representation. The one mentioned here is usually done very small like a mortar and pestle, not as if you're stirring a soup pot.

So is this use (at 0:30) the "eat your heart out" meaning?
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vt2L_gYvd4]YouTube - belly dance nava aharoni baladi ×*×�וה ×�הרו×*×™[/ame]

I'm wondering though...if this isn't also used sort of "tongue in cheek"?

Perhaps it has some double meaning depending on contexts.

Originally Posted by ssipes

So is this use (at 0:30) the "eat your heart out" meaning?
YouTube - belly dance nava aharoni baladi ×*×�וה ×�הרו×*×™

WOW what a great clip! I loooove her interpretation of the song.

I wonder...since in Tahtil Shubbak the singer is expressing infatuation, in the sense of "OMG you are so hot it is KILLING me!" whether the gesture here refers to the "salt in the wound" meaning mentioned above.

I'm going to try to remember to watch this with the BF tonight and see what his thoughts are. My suspicion is that like with a lot of words in the Arabic language, this gesture probably carries a lot of meanings.

Nisaa

I suppose it could mean both in the sense that, "ohhh, you are hurting me, I'm in so much pain..you're rubbing salt in my wounds" or "see what I'm gonna do to you...I'm rubbing salt in your wounds...

In a Mahmoud Reda class in Egypt he told a few of is that it has to do with grinding pepper. He explained that "back in the day" if someone said something that you didn't like you would brush/blow pepper at them. So the grinding motion is literally grinding the pepper. It was in a choreography about love/jealousy.
I also saw a peice by Virginia who does it in "Harramt Ahibek" SHe grinds then brushes it off her hand. Its on one of her hollywood video series.
xoxo,
-NJ

So my understanding is that the gesture can be used both tongue in cheek, sarcastically or actually showing "displeasment"...

kind of like when Persians bite the flesh between their thumb and palm/fingers or when Punjabis do a thumbs-up, which basically means "me no like"/"protect me from your bad vibes/thoughts/words".

Humor me here for a moment...

Nava - if that is the name of the dancer, could be using this gesture, since it is so early on in the song (prior to the lyrics) as a bit of commentary on Dina, who I understand "owned this song". Especially since she does the finger under the nose coyness , rapidly followed with the hand brushing - throw away- gesture..all one right after the other? That is the impression I got when I first watched this clip about 5 months ago. Left field...or no? ..c::

Originally Posted by ssipes

So is this use (at 0:30) the "eat your heart out" meaning?
YouTube - belly dance nava aharoni baladi ×*×�וה ×�הרו×*×™

So I watched this clip with the BF, and as soon as she did the gesture he smiled, and I asked him what he felt it meant, and immediately he said "She's saying 'You're jealous of ME!'" So smug it is!!!!!!

I asked whether the gesture can also refer to anger/jealousy, and his opinion was yes, in the sense of "I'm gonna grind you into dust!" (yikes). So it seems there are multiple meanings floating around around.

Again I must say how much I loooooove this clip. She's dreamy!

So what does the long beard gesture that she follows up with, mean? I thougt it was a way of saying someone was wise?

I've had this favorited for along time and have never figured out what that means and I also think she is impersonating Dina.