Thread: Using Middle Eastern music for beginners?

How many teachers here use Middle Eastern music in your classrooms for beginning students? I do.

How many of you students are attending classes in which the teacher uses Middle Eastern music?

It seems as though some belly dance teachers think students won't understand or "get" Middle Eastern music, that it's necessary to "dumb down" the class by using Western pop music such as Natacha Atlas or Lorena McKennitt. What do bhuzzards think?

our profs use more 'pop' like natacha atlas, or remixes of ME classics, generally techno-y, or BDSS music. not much "real" ME music other than drum solos. but i think that's personal preference rather than trying to 'dumb down' the class.

I never use western pop music. I always use Middle Eastern music and tell people about the culture and what the songs are about.
My beginners class use mainly Egyptian pop or folk with a few instrumentals and I introduce classics like Aziza and Zeina as we go along. it is a Middle eastern dance therefore I use Middle Eastern music. I teach Egyptian styles i don't fuse or tribal, or pirate or Burlesque or what ever.

When I started my teacher used Port Said & BDSS..Hope that helps

Mostly I use ME ("classical" or "standard" ) music but I do include Egyptian pop and for tribal either specially composed tribal music or often ME folkloric.
I don't use Western music at all and I don't encourage students ever to use it..the opposite in fact.

My teacher uses Middle Eastern classical, Middle Eastern pop, instrumental, vocal, etc... but she has always talked to us about what it is or isn't, where it would be appropriate to use and the differences between.

My classes have always used a variety of ME music. Some pop/BDSS but also a lot of classics. Unfortunately I had to spend time on my own really learning the difference since it wasn't necessarily explained in class.

It's almost never occurred to me to use anything BUT middle eastern music. I use a variety of stuff when I drill, including some of the techno remixes, Arabic pop, and Hossam Ramzy stuff.

I find it really hard to incorporate the classics into class, the sort of 'songs every bellydancer should know' like Zeina, Aziza, Tamra Henna and Om K pieces. Too many changes for drilling or improv, and I can't seem to choreograph group/student dances to such rich music. I've tried, but it feels awful to me -- like we're dancing over the music -- and I always give up in disgust.

How do other teachers incorporate rich music with lots of changes into the classroom?

My instructor uses ME music for all our classes that I'm aware of. It would feel weird to me to be learning bellydance to, say, western pop music. Although we have done dances to Arabic Pop music.

Originally Posted by Lauren_

It's almost never occurred to me to use anything BUT middle eastern music. I use a variety of stuff when I drill, including some of the techno remixes, Arabic pop, and Hossam Ramzy stuff.

I find it really hard to incorporate the classics into class, the sort of 'songs every bellydancer should know' like Zeina, Aziza, Tamra Henna and Om K pieces. Too many changes for drilling or improv, and I can't seem to choreograph group/student dances to such rich music. I've tried, but it feels awful to me -- like we're dancing over the music -- and I always give up in disgust.

How do other teachers incorporate rich music with lots of changes into the classroom?

It's very difficult for the reasons you cite, Lauren. I, too, can't "ignore" what the music is doing and it pains me to simply do another 8 counts of simple back horizontal 8s when what I really should be doing are figure 8s with 2 counts on the right, 1 count on the left, then right again and one seriously long 4 count on the left. That's why I use "simpler" Mohammed El-Bakkar, George Abdo et al pieces for drilling and the less complex stuff of Hossam Ramzy and some of his "modern" friends (tho I avoid Emad Sayyah because he makes me gag most -- maybe not all -- but most of the time) for choreos.

We're talkin' beginners here.

Deborah

If you want an honest answer from me, I would stop going to my teacher's class if she started playing western pop music for us to dance to. I would absolutely want my teacher to keep the music strictly ME and with as much authenticity as possible. I don't want to come off as a sourpuss or anything like that, but what's the point of going to bellydance class if an instructor decides to play western pop music during drills? When I go to bellydance class, we learn everything about the history of middle eastern dance, different music styles, costuming, egyptian/turkish cabaret dancing, folkloric dancing etc. Playing anything other than ME music would be a considered a 'bellydance faux pas', in my opinion.

My instructor uses traditional ME instrumentals and Egyptian pop or regular Egyptian music (she loves Amr Diab and other artists similiar). It's all ME music and our class appreciates every bit of it. If someone didn't, oh well. She also takes the time to explain the song if we're not getting the emotions or movements right, and she loves when we ask her to translate it. They all have deep meanings, or are about love.

I agree with you all the way, Andalee. That was one of the reasons I left a class.

I use a variety of ME music in classes. It is a wonderful way to teach students about composers, famous singers, history of the area during the time it was composed, rhythms and rhythmic changes, prominent instruments, etc. Many happy students report they enjoy this aspect of class as much as the dancing :)

Sabra*

Originally Posted by Lauren_

It's almost never occurred to me to use anything BUT middle eastern music. I use a variety of stuff when I drill, including some of the techno remixes, Arabic pop, and Hossam Ramzy stuff.

I find it really hard to incorporate the classics into class, the sort of 'songs every bellydancer should know' like Zeina, Aziza, Tamra Henna and Om K pieces. Too many changes for drilling or improv, and I can't seem to choreograph group/student dances to such rich music. I've tried, but it feels awful to me -- like we're dancing over the music -- and I always give up in disgust.

How do other teachers incorporate rich music with lots of changes into the classroom?

Wow, Lauren - get out of my head!

The only way I've been able to introduce the classics is to go over the whole song in lecture format, but then just have them do combinations to one or two parts of the song. But even then, I don't do that with beginners because my Beginning class is primarily a drilling class format.

Everything Lauren said, including the question.

The only way I can see fitting nice rich music into class is, as laura 2 says, in a sort of lecture or workshop format where you talk them through it and get them to improvise sections, just so they get the feel of it.

Back in the day, we used to have an "advanced" class where we would do things like go through a classical piece and develop a proper individual choreo to it, but that fell by the wayside. I'd like to bring that back in again, but the trouble seems to be that as a class, it's not enough spoon-feeding and the opportunities for performance of said piece are lower, so people drop out. So you have to make it a group number and instantly it becomes that much more simplistic.

Originally Posted by zumarrad

Back in the day, we used to have an "advanced" class where we would do things like go through a classical piece and develop a proper individual choreo to it, but that fell by the wayside. I'd like to bring that back in again, but the trouble seems to be that as a class, it's not enough spoon-feeding and the opportunities for performance of said piece are lower, so people drop out. So you have to make it a group number and instantly it becomes that much more simplistic.

Group dancing simply must be more simplistic. A soloist can take a group choreo and make it so much richer, even if every move is repeated "verbatim," so to speak. A soloist can *ooze" his/her way through a movement in a way that simply can't be done by a group, no matter how well-trained and rehearsed.

Deborah

Yes, but learning endless group dances doesn't teach them how to do that. So you're back to square - well, not square one, but not square 10 either.

I do a whole session on 'solo skills' once or twice a year with my advanced dancers, but I let them each choose their own music to work on.

I feel like there's SO much to teach about soloing vs. group choreo... I keep offering a 'solo skills' course, but not enough are interested.

Originally Posted by zumarrad

Everything Lauren said, including the question.

The only way I can see fitting nice rich music into class is, as laura 2 says, in a sort of lecture or workshop format where you talk them through it and get them to improvise sections, just so they get the feel of it.

I'm trying this out with one of my groups this term. I think it's good to get to know the classic the songs by yourself, I'm just acting as a kind of introduction agency.

Funny....I don't think that I have used anything else, like Lauren mentioned! I think its a little bit overwhelming if you start diving into all the rhythms and instruments right away, for beginners that is. It is important, according to my curriculum, that they start listening to it from the start. It gets them accustomed to non 8/8s which is foreign to American ears.
The way I incorporate some of the classics is when we drill improvisation. I get the girls in a circle, and since i know the phasing of the music I will go around the room and tag someone to go into the center of the circle for improv. That way each person gets something a little bit different and its not too intimidating since some of the phrasing is only 4-8 8cts. At the same time they get to listen to the music and figure out how the music changes and what to do. You can step this up to intermediate by having the person in the circle chose the next person so that THEY have to recognize phrase changing!

If someone doesn't much care for the music even after a session or two then they weren't meant to be a ME dancer!

xoxo,
-NJ

I always use Middle Eastern music - usually Arabic - from day one. I include beledi, pop, and shaabi for beginners. I don't introduce full blown classical orientale until they have some experience.

Originally Posted by kashmir

I always use Middle Eastern music - usually Arabic - from day one. I include beledi, pop, and shaabi for beginners. I don't introduce full blown classical orientale until they have some experience.

When I taught regular classes, this is what I did.

When subbing for a friend's beginners class (she's a tribal fusion teacher) I was specifically asked to teach an intro to 9/8...so I'd have had a hard time using western pop/non-Turkish even if I wanted to (much of the new Balkan stuff being heavier on the 7's than the 9's), but I did progress from a very slow Romani (Agir, I think) to a little quicker and then tied it into the sort of music they are used to (ME inspired but more electronic) with a syncopated 9/8 from Beats Antique...and gave out a worksheet about the music we'd used, where to find it, and what sort of 9/8 it used and which beats, if any, were more heavily accented.

I've always been taught with a variety of ME music with the more light-hearted side of ME songs used as "gateways" to more serious fare.

I use a lot of folk and shaabi music for regular classes. I save the classics for "projects" or choreographies. Most of the standard classics are listed in our study literature... I also try to mention the most common standards when teaching throughout the year so students are familiar with the names.

I would find it difficult to educate people on the Middle Eastern rhythms if I didnt use Middle Eastern music in class, however, I use quite a few cross references where appropriate to open people's mind to concepts and/or sounds that cross between styles.

DaVid

Originally Posted by mmouse1534

If someone doesn't much care for the music even after a session or two then they weren't meant to be a ME dancer!

that's a little harsh...

I attended a friend's beginner class recently and she didn't play a single Middle-Eastern song during the hour-long class. She teaches tribal fusion that is based primarily in cue-based improv. I recognized a Siouxsie and the Banshees song and the rest was music in the same vein. It was disheartening.

Originally Posted by Lauren_

I do a whole session on 'solo skills' once or twice a year with my advanced dancers, but I let them each choose their own music to work on.

I feel like there's SO much to teach about soloing vs. group choreo... I keep offering a 'solo skills' course, but not enough are interested.

Lauren, this is the kind of class that I desperately wish was offered in my city! *sigh*

I only use ME music and try to pick out a variety. It's all fairly simple stuff that we can drill with, though. I used a remix in class once but I found it had too many changes that I couldn't ignore for baby bellies.

As stated it never occured to me to use anything but ME music.
For beginners pop works well but I also use a small piece of classic stuff for a combo here and there as well. I give them a taste so to speak. Most want to know the music I use so I give a list out. Many go home and listen to the music.
I am at a bit of a lose as to way a teacher would not use ME music in class?

Originally Posted by *Shira*

How many teachers here use Middle Eastern music in your classrooms for beginning students? I do.

How many of you students are attending classes in which the teacher uses Middle Eastern music?

It seems as though some belly dance teachers think students won't understand or "get" Middle Eastern music, that it's necessary to "dumb down" the class by using Western pop music such as Natacha Atlas or Lorena McKennitt. What do bhuzzards think?

I use a blend of ME music, ME lounge/techno/pop, folk music (traditional saidi pieces), some Westernized pop (Natacha Atlas/other), but I teach my beginner choreography to M.A. Wahab's "Maoukeb Elnour" - the original version. My students are introduced to a variety of music right away, so there's always something to interest everyone, and they are introduced to the sound of mizmar very early on.

The song I use most often in my classes (and which I will probably continue to use forever because I can't find one I like as well) is "Arabian Knights" from Hossam Ramzy. It's perfect for class - very even tempo and a droning melody that is not distracting to talk over, and still very traditional sounding, with mizmar and rabab.

I also sometimes lead a class follow the leader "improv" section to "Khusara Khusara" by Hossam Ramzy - students always giggle when they first hear it, because it was sampled for "Big Pimpin" a few years ago.

Originally Posted by Kathiya

that's a little harsh...

No it's not.