Thread: Troupe cane with lefties

I have a troupe of 7 girls. One is left handed. So far I am trying to alternate cane moves both on right and left hand, but this is starting to look like a disaster as non-dominant hands have much less control over the cane. Should I keep them using both right an left handed cane moves or just have everyone use their dominant hand to keep the dance looking nice? Though for formation, the poor left handed girl will always have to be on the left side to keep the canes from hitting.

Any advise, suggestions?

I'm a lefty and I've done troupe cane choreographies before. I was just forced to learn how to swing the cane with both hands. It actually really came in handy as I can now do double cane and switch hands off while performing. I say give your lefty a private or two to teach her how to hold and swing righty and give her some time to catch on. It is possible.

Yep, the lefty twirls right-handed to match the group and avoid a big mess -- there's already enough potential for collisions and difficulty synching if everyone's working right-handed! As Tanya said, the payoff for your lefty is (marketable) versatility, as well as a greater sense of accomplishment.

What a great opportunity for everyone in the troupe to master cane movements with their non-dominant hand!

(I'm a lefty, and I need versatility to fit into troupe dances.. but I'm a firm believer in it no matter what. Whether zills/sagat, cane, castanets, baton, playing piano... I've always been taught to work until the weaker hand/side can do the actions just as well.)

I practice on both hands equally and make my students do the same : )

I'm a lefty and always practice using both hands. I think everyone should practice both, so I vote for keeping the choreo complete with alternating hands.

Originally Posted by Reinaa

I practice on both hands equally and make my students do the same : )

Me too! Make them ALL practice on both sides so that they are comfortable doing both sides.

Originally Posted by Lesedi

Me too! Make them ALL practice on both sides so that they are comfortable doing both sides.

As a lefty I can't actually do cane left handed as when given the option I decided to learn it the same way as everyone else.

as a matter of fact I don't find any moves easier to do on one side than the other as I have always had to learn first on my non-dominant side. A tip for teachers and students perhaps?

Many years ago our troupe was pretty evenly split between lefties and righties so all our choreographies used the dominant hands.

I would suggest people learn on both sides - however, experience would suggest lefties learn right handed easier than the other way around.

Thanks for the great feedback everyone! I think I will continue to make everyone use both hands. It is a pretty simple choreography and all the moves on the right hand are repeated on the left hand. I'll have to admit that it was pretty despairing when all the righties had to do the twirls with their left hand, but I won't give up yet!

I like having everyone try using their non-dominant hands. Yes, it will be hard at first, but this will help maintain balance in their bodies. This is what's appealing to me as a student. Besides, the left-handed person has probably had to spend a lot of her life trying to fit in with the right-handed people so this will sort of even the score.

Just to be clear, I wasn't advocating discrimination against lefties! But I know firsthand that "every dancer use her dominant hand" in a group setting is a recipe for bruises and flying canes. As long as everyone's using the same hand at the same time, you'll be fine. ;)

Originally Posted by Suzana

But I know firsthand that "every dancer use her dominant hand" in a group setting is a recipe for bruises and flying canes.

Yes, this is what I'm trying to avoid at all costs!

Bumper canes: never a good look!

I'm left handed, and I was taught to twirl with my right hand since everyone else was right-hand dominant. I actually feel more comfortable using my right hand for some moves since that was how I first learned them. But I may be slightly better at picking up moves on my left hand just because it is my dominant writing hand and therefore a little stronger. And I can flip the cane almost equally as well (or as badly sometimes!) now with both hands.

Make your lefty learn how to swing with her right hand.

I'm a lefty and I had to learn how to swing with my right hand for consistence... now I always practice with both hands and I am able to spin the cane with both hands, and thus do double cane. Although my left hand is still better in certain directions or when spinning very fast, this is hardly noticeable because I am as good at spinning with the right hand as the rest of the class.

It would be great if everyone could learn how to spin with both hands, but for now the easiest solution is to get that one person to conform!

My wife's a lefty - and for better or worse, she learned cane with her right. I'm not convinced she's totally comfortable with that. I'm a righty - and doing cane with my left hand is an utter disaster...

Originally Posted by zorba

My wife's a lefty - and for better or worse, she learned cane with her right. I'm not convinced she's totally comfortable with that. I'm a righty - and doing cane with my left hand is an utter disaster...

i have been folllowing this ..i was taught you never switch hands due to righ hand/ left hand laws. i was also taught to spin backwards . but i realize that was when we worked with live bands...if you loose the cane, and are spinning backwards, the band gets it , that was the reasoning. there are moves you spin forward...but i was told you never hold in left hand.

At least among the Egyptian and Lebanese dancers I've seen and studied with, there's no taboo against using the left hand for cane or switching hands. Who does this come from, Cory?

Originally Posted by zamora

i have been folllowing this ..i was taught you never switch hands due to righ hand/ left hand laws. i was also taught to spin backwards . but i realize that was when we worked with live bands...if you loose the cane, and are spinning backwards, the band gets it , that was the reasoning. there are moves you spin forward...but i was told you never hold in left hand.

I took a workshop with Morocco where she said it's considered rude to spin the cane with the left hand because of something to the effect that in certain places in the Arab world (forgive me, I forgot what geographic region she was specifically talking about, but I would imagine it would be in the Said, since this was a Saidi cane workshop), that is the hand you would use to wipe yourself...

While I took that to mean it is more authentic to spin with the right hand, I don't take these taboos completely to heart. Not all Arabs have the same culture and I would doubt that Arabs here in the US and in the cities of the Middle East would really care if they saw a dancer spin a cane with her left hand.

Tito for example, handles his sticks with both hands for these performances:

I don't think anyone really cares.

I think this is similar to that "never show the palm of your hands" taboo. Apparently, some Bedouin do find that offensive, but not all Arabs do. I have asked all my Arab friends about it, and none of them had any idea what I was talking about, plus, I have seen Egyptian dancers show the palms of their hands when dancing.

I've heard that some Arabs do not care for using the left hand for cane when it's only one stick, but if you are doing double cane, you have to, and they don't think it's a problem. I suspect this falls under the same collection of "advice" as showing the palm or sole of the foot--a kernel of truth and a lot of "telephone game" built around it. Anything can be offensive if you try hard enough (holding your hand palm out is a different gesture than sticking your hand "STOP!" in someone's face), and there will always be a few people who can find a way to be offended on principle, but everybody else is either mildly amused by our turning their innocent, social traditions into "RULES" ("Really? I've never heard that before. Why did you say we do this?"), or they're insulted that we're assuming they still live according to some primitive culture, when they may have a modern lifestyle with all the contemporary trappings ("No, we don't still squat on the ground and wipe ourselves with our bare left hands anymore. You might have noticed we're constructing our 'tents' out of masonry, steel, and glass, with electricity and indoor plumbing nowadays.").

Western cultures have all sorts of etiquette rules, too. Sometimes the reason has been mostly forgotten (Why do we shake hands with the right?), and other times, they're common sense (most people are right handed, so the knife goes on the right side of the plate when setting a table), but if a foreigner gets confused and does something the "wrong" way, or a left-handed person defaults to left preference, we just shrug it off, because it's really not that big a deal.

I think it's a dubious assertion, actually, and it directly contradicts what I've been told by teachers and dancers *from the culture in question* and what I've personally observed them doing. If someone's got an authoritative native source to cite, I'd really like to know. Seriously. The difference between what exists in the culture and what we extrapolate or invent based on what we know about it (or think we know about it) matters a lot, and not just to me.

There are definitely some stick-related movements that are controversial and debatable even among "natives": kicking the stick, rolling it on the body, even balancing. But this ain't that. So enlighten me.

Originally Posted by Suzana

There are definitely some stick-related movements that are controversial and debatable even among "natives": kicking the stick, rolling it on the body, even balancing. But this ain't that. So enlighten me.

"Controversial and debatable" as in "inauthentic" or "vulgar and inappropriate"? IIRC, I've seen natives plant the stick and kick it up into a twirl, but I have been repeatedly told that the cane should not be used as a balancing prop.

Originally Posted by Suzana

The difference between what exists in the culture and what we extrapolate or invent based on what we know about it (or think we know about it) matters a lot, and not just to me.

Hurrah!!!

Thanks. :)

Controversial as in disputed for whatever reason -- not necessarily heatedly disputed. There are greater and lesser degrees of disagreement among "native" dancers about those three things. I don't mean they're standing backstage arguing about these movements. I mean some do it, some don't, some teach it, some don't, some say they're fine with seeing it, some do not.

Rolling the cane: seen as vulgar, except by those who do it anyway for their own reasons (because it looks sexy?) and/or don't see it as vulgar.
Balancing: seen as inauthentic, except by those who do it anyway for their own reasons (because it looks impressive?) and/or don't see it as inauthentic.
Kicking the stick: seen as disrespectful, except by those who do it anyway for their own reasons (because it looks snazzy?) and/or don't see it as disrespectful.

I'm asking for "native" sources on left-handed cane-handling being frowned upon because I really want to know. I've never encountered a negative spin (sorry) on that from any Egyptian or Lebanese source, and I'd honestly like to know if I've missed something.

Let's see...bintbeled? Shems? Monica? phillyraqs? flimflamgirl? Other cane-packin' mamas?
Where are you and what have you got on leftiness, please?

Originally Posted by Suzana

At least among the Egyptian and Lebanese dancers I've seen and studied with, there's no taboo against using the left hand for cane or switching hands. Who does this come from, Cory?

Yes, I've been at a workshop with Yousry Sharif (Egyptian) who had has switching hands throughout a cane choreography - ending with an amazing fast poi move swapping hands on each turn!

Originally Posted by Tourbeau

I've seen natives plant the stick and kick it up into a twirl, but I have been repeatedly told that the cane should not be used as a balancing prop.

But Denise Enan (Egyptian) includes balancing a cane in one of her ghazwazee choreographies (but I haven't seen her do it in sa`iidi cane)

Originally Posted by kashmir

Yes, I've been at a workshop with Yousry Sharif (Egyptian) who had has switching hands throughout a cane choreography - ending with an amazing fast poi move swapping hands on each turn!

I love that one! Very cool. :)

I'm another leftie who learned right handed to blend with the other troupe members. Left handed people are used to adapting to a right handed world so I would just tell her to twirl right handed.