Thread: Touch or No Touch ??

Even though I've taught for 15+ years, I still run across this mini-conundrum in my mind, I think to a fault because I err on the side of caution...

To Touch or Not To Touch Your Students...

Of course I'm referring to actually putting your hands on a baby beginner students' hips to direct a figure 8 when they're clearly struggling and cannot translate the movement to their body?

Or lifting the arms if they're chicken claws and drooping?

Or pressing down the shoulders if they're hunched up by the ears?

Or touching the upper back area to point out where a contraction should take place?

Related to this...are you laissez-faire and allow a student to struggle for a short time before correcting? Or are you constantly on top of her/him, ensuring they get it right the first time?

Do you leave those who are clearly understanding and brilliant alone and let them do their thing in favour of those who are not?

Do you correct EVERY student who is doing some LITTLE thing wrong or let it slide in the interest of making sure the entire class gets it generally correct?

WHEN do you know students are struggling if, in your judgment, they ARE getting the movements but you hear later on that you've conducted the class too fast and too advanced? And the student does not speak up during class?

P.S. I should add that I become concerned about these Touch/NoTouch issues b/c in the litigious-happy U.S. of A., sexual harassment is such a huge issue.

I touch. And sometimes I also let them touch me. I find that it helps them.
You can always warn them: "I am going to pull here now".

Sometimes I give their shoulders a little stroke to remind them to relax them.
I also sometimes let them do things in pairs where one holds the other on a certain body part to help practice isolation.

Especially when I teach my shimmy workshops I will let them practice and walk through the room and give everybody feedback.
The good ones need to know that they are doing it right as well!
But when I go from one to one it's more personal.
If I find that 3 people are doing the same mistake I go back in front of the class and address this special problem. Like this they feel that they are not alone in their struggle.

My classes are usually not more than 12 people, so I can give personal attention which I like.

MEISSOUN

Like Meissoun I touch - but ask permission with beginners (if other students had problems with this I won't touch). And yes, sometimes they want to feel what my body is doing so they can compare.

How long I leave a student before correcting depends on the student, the problem and the type of class. Dangerous things I jump on regularly. If a student has muliple problems I usually pick the worst one - or the one I haven't commented on for a while.

I don't like to hit any one student with a ton of correction on the same day. Possible exception is pre-show rehearsals. Also, I like to spread the load. If I have to correct A a couple of times I'll also point out things B & C need to work on.

I also like to make sure I say at least one positive thing to each person in each class.

from a student's perspective: don't touch, don't touch, don't touch unless the student gives you express permission beforehand.

I touch, but not so much. This has to do with the fact that I mostly teach beginners and a lot of time is spent on showing and explaining to the whole group. Since time is limited in class and since I find that beginners have a hard time working on moves without someone leading I find that the time I have to go around and make the adjustments hands on is limited. I would like to do this more, but then I would have to have someone help me out with keeping the drills going.

As Meissoun I also let them feel me, especially while doing shimmyexercises.

I let my students struggle for a while, before correcting, at least when it is a new movement unless they are doing something that could clearly damage them.

But I try to give every student something, and always offer them a one on one mini feedback time at the end of the term, just to let them feel that I see them in class although my corrections often are general.

I think it's a good idea to make it a regular habit to ask "is it okay if I touch you?" so they are warned when you go to make a correction. If they don't want you to touch to correct them, sometimes you can have them touch themselves to make the correction. There is something about hands on a body though that helps people find muscles and fix things much more easily than just trying to do it through description.

As far as how often to correct and when. It's a judgment call. You have to strike a balance between making necessary personal corrections and keeping a class moving. Too much or too little can be annoying. In the very beginning classes, sometimes I'll teach a movement and let everybody work on it, then tell them they must practice for a minute or two as I quickly go around the room and make sure each individual is doing it correctly. If everybody is getting personal attention as a distinct part of the class it often goes over better.

I used to ask permission first and same goes in my real life former job selling swimwear and fashion, it was neccessary for me to feel if the swimwear was tight enough, looking alone often wasn't enough and I never had anyone decline my fingers slipping into bikini bottoms. now that sounds rather rude doesn't it? I promise I didn't linger beyond the edges.

Not a teacher (yet) but when/if I do start teaching, I think that sometimes touching is the best way to get through to some people. Always ask permission though; not everyone feels comfortable with their personal space being "invaded"

As far as how long to go w/o correction...that's tough. Some people don't seem to want correction (I'm not one of them!) but if they're doing something that could hurt them, correct right away! Otherwise I guess it's a case-by-case basis...?

ask first. out of courtesy and a fear of lawsuits.

I am not a teacher, but I don't mind my instructor touching at all, I find it very helpful, and she also gets us to put our hands on her hips for example to get the fell of a movement. I know my instructor judges who is receptive and who wouldn't be. She tends not to touch 'raw' beginners, but assesses them for a while, and see how they respond to those of us who have been around for sometime when she touches us to correct us. But will correct them if something is out of whack, and sometimes suggests they might like to 'feel' the movement either as she is doing it or as some of us 'older' students are doing it. We are all very use to contact so are happy to 'share".

Coming at this with a European mindset, I am totally OK with hand-on corrections. In fact, I have always been grateful for it, it has helped me tremendously. What has often confused me is the teacher asking: I am up to my ears concentrated, and then I face a question that has such an obviously "eeh, erm, yeah, what, huh, yes, of course" answer. That's been the biggest problem with the topic for me ;-) I think it may be a better choice to settle the "is it OK" before class starts.

Like everyone here has said- ask first before touching.
Sometimes it's a simple as placing my hand on their knee as I remind them to bend it more. Often they don't realize what they're doing and a simple touch helps their awareness enough to fix it themselves.
For those who want a "less invasive" approach I put my hand where I want their body part to go- for example "move the side of your hips to go all the way out to my hands" - it's still helping with a tactile approach, but some people feel more comfortable being in control of the touching. These approaches also make it so they can't say "she made me do it and now I'm injured"...they're doing the actual movement themselves. But I avoid having those crazies around anyway.
I also let them touch me to get the feel of a movement.
Touch is extremely helpful in learning, from my own personal experience.

Well, you've been dancing and teaching a heck of a lot longer than I have... but here's my two little cents. Hopefully they'll help, if even a little?

To me, a lot of it depends on your approach and the personality of your student. Rarely will I touch a student, and if I do it is because I've asked permission or because I know them well enough to do so. What seems to work best for my students is getting them to put their own hands on their own bodies - I feel it's more effective than my touching them anyway, and then I don't have to worry about making anyone uncomfortable.

I think it's important to get things right from the start, so yes - I will "pick" on them until they get it. That said, I will only pick on them for one or two moves each class because I want them to have fun and not become too frustrated.. I will let the rest of their troubled moves slide until next class. If other people are moving along quicker, you have to accommodate them too, so I try very hard to balance it out. If working with someone is taking longer than I expect it to, then I give the others something to play with during that time. (ie. simple layers or traveling).

If I work with the same person on the same movement more than 3 or 4 times with success (they were getting it in class) yet to discover they still continue to forget how to do it the following class, I will let it go. At that point I assume it's because they haven't practiced. I realize not everyone wants to practice, and that's okay... but I won't eat up class time because of it.

As for students who are "getting it" and complaining afterwards it's too hard... maybe they just need a little more repetition to feel more comfortable with a move before moving onto the next?

Like most people on this thread I do use hands on methods sometimes, but I always ask permission from the student first. I also get them to do hands on work in pairs, always with the option of not taking part if they aren't comfortable. It might be adjusting their arm position, keeping shoulders down, keeping hips still, moving the hips...I'll also get them to hold on to my hips and follow a movement. So far noone has declined to take part in any of these exercises, and I once had a student who could only get a move after she'd held on to my hips! I think it's a really useful teaching method.

From a student's perspective...

I like to be touched. Sometimes it is the touch that makes everything clear (particularly in posture). But I guess it is a good idea to ask first whenever it comes to touching. When I took teacher training, we learned that some people are kinesthetic learners and learn best by touch (either touching the teacher, touching themselves, being touched). So it's a good approach for some people who might not be getting it by hearing your explanation or watching your demonstration.

I also agree that you should spread your criticism out and try not to focus all your criticism on one person, or they might end up thinking that they are the worst student in the class or even completely hopeless if they get critique in a lot of areas. Give them one piece of critique to focus on at a time, whether it's posture, technique, or whatever. People can't focus on so many things at once - they _can_ work on one thing, make it automatic and then work on the next.

Sometimes I feel like Gumby...

My teacher has been known to come over and pull down on shoulders, adjust arms, push in on belly, etc.

Not so much recently as I'm actually getting better posturewise - but recently I asked her to "fix my arms" as they were all wrong for what we were doing.

It pretty amusing to see my 4 foot 9 instructor adjusting a 6 foot + guy!

Not only do I touch...I enlist the aid of a troupe member who may be in class. It is a technique I wanted to share. The full body undulation is very difficult to explain to some people. 10 different visualizations later...still no progress. This one is also hard to do in a "hands on" type approach. So, I call for a "camel sandwich" I stand behind the student, troupe member is in front and she and I then proceed to do very slow full body undulations while keeping tight full body contact with the student. It can be lots of fun and sometimes in a light hearted mood the entire class will end up with a conga line actually walking the undulation from one side to the other while looking in the mirror. Yes..unconventional, but fun and effective.

For my teaching style, touching the student works well. I usually do this, for ex, while teaching beginners a move like figure 8s, and I'll tell them that I'm the Figure Eight Doctor. Then I go around the room to check on individual technique, occasionally popping to the front of the class to show a general correction. For individual correction, I ask "Can I drive?" and from their responses can tell how touchy-feely to be. I also tend to give my students affectionate pats, and so far no complaints. And if they want to hang on to my hips while I'm doing a figure 8 to get the feel of it, they're certainly welcome to do so. So far I haven't freaked anyone out, and my students seem to welcome being touched. They enjoy it.

That said, I have been in a workshop where the teacher's touch was most unwelcome. She was kind of in our faces, wrenching hands and arms into the right position. Ugh. Won't go back. The touching was not done with affection/encouragement, but was more like a punishment. A friend remarked afterwards that she had never enjoyed a workshop less.

Latifa

Hi,

From the first day of class we explain to the students that they will get personalized attention ..g.: and give an explanation of why this helps them.

When people understand the reasoning behind something it helps them be more receptive. Never had bad feedback on this.

In regard to touching a student, we always ask first before touching. Majority of the time the student is ok with this. For the rare occurrence a student isn't ok, we simply have them place their hands on themselves after touching the instructor in the area being demonstrated and ask them to imitate the movement that they felt. This usually helps.

Does this help?

As a student I like to be touched too, especially when it's a relaxing touch that helps release tension at the same time. "Pressing " someone's shoulders down doesn't seem like it'd go over so well with some, whereas "smoothing" from the neck down would get the point across without anyone feeling offended. So I guess I mean hands-on without being too-hands on. And less for beginners (brand new students might be off-put by touching too soon) and more for those you're getting to know.

The only time I'd interfere immediately is if whatever the student is doing could cause injury; otherwise give them a bit to figure it out on their own before correcting. Maybe ask your students if they are struggling at all every now and then, or after new moves...or if you see any of those befuddled looks.....c::

I think touch is sometimes the best way to illustrate something or to gently correct someone's position or movement. But some people don't like to be touched.

I used to have a yoga teacher who would deal with that in this way: At the beginning of every class, she would say that she sometimes uses touch to help explain something, and encourage people to let her know if they don't want to be touched. In addition, before touching someone she would always say something like, "I'm going to put my hand on your back now." I thought her approach was very respectful and really helped build a trustful teacher-student relationship.

Originally Posted by anala

Not only do I touch...I enlist the aid of a troupe member who may be in class. It is a technique I wanted to share. The full body undulation is very difficult to explain to some people. 10 different visualizations later...still no progress. This one is also hard to do in a "hands on" type approach. So, I call for a "camel sandwich" I stand behind the student, troupe member is in front and she and I then proceed to do very slow full body undulations while keeping tight full body contact with the student. It can be lots of fun and sometimes in a light hearted mood the entire class will end up with a conga line actually walking the undulation from one side to the other while looking in the mirror. Yes..unconventional, but fun and effective.

..g.: This one I´m going to remember since I will be teaching them soon ..g.:

I will go for the touch if the student is still struggling despite different types of verbal instructions and demonstration. I'll go over to them and say, "May I touch you" before doing so. There has been a couple of times when, as I've approached the person, they've started shrinking away and clearly communicating "DON'T TOUCH ME!" through their body language. In those cases I forgo the touching even if I think it might help.

I'm not a particularly touchy person myself, so I appreciate it if an instructor tries to get through to me in other ways first. But if I'm not getting it, I have no problem with them physically correcting me with their hands.

I like being touched, but understand that that's just my preference and that most would like you to ask their permission before doing so. When Rachel Brice was teaching regular classes in SF (5 years ago) she would come around and touch spots that needed lifting in our back or she'd reposition our arms or head, etc. I found that really helpful.

Originally Posted by Azhia

Even though I've taught for 15+ years, I still run across this mini-conundrum in my mind, I think to a fault because I err on the side of caution...

To Touch or Not To Touch Your Students...

Of course I'm referring to actually putting your hands on a baby beginner students' hips to direct a figure 8 when they're clearly struggling and cannot translate the movement to their body?

Or lifting the arms if they're chicken claws and drooping?
etc etc...

I touch in limited capacities without asking--as you say, lifting the arm or relaxing the shoulder. If it is a more intimate touch, or lengthy, such as helping to guide hips or poking the belly or chest, I will ask, of conversely I will invite them to touch ME in key places while I perform the move so they can feel how the mechanics go in my body. One common example is when I am teaching figure 8's with the hips, sometimes I will have them stand behind me and put their hands gently on my hips to feel me and try to follow along. It really helps.

Related to this...are you laissez-faire and allow a student to struggle for a short time before correcting? Or are you constantly on top of her/him, ensuring they get it right the first time?

Do you leave those who are clearly understanding and brilliant alone and let them do their thing in favour of those who are not?

Do you correct EVERY student who is doing some LITTLE thing wrong or let it slide in the interest of making sure the entire class gets it generally correct?

I think you do have to let students do some amount of struggling through the attempts at the move without correcting. I think of it this way: Some students are clearly struggling because they don't quite understand, or clearly need another explanation or connection made for them, and I help them. But some students are making the RIGHT mistakes, and then I leave alone. That is, there is some amount of limitations in the body which prevent dancers from doing a move fully and/or entirely correctly, but you can see the beginnings of the mechanics of the move and can tell they are "on the right track" I leave them alone. Or sometimes I will come over and briefly say that. "It's small, but it's there! Keep it up!" "Not quite, but you're getting there. You understand what it is you're trying to do, I can tell. Any questions?" or something along those line.

WHEN do you know students are struggling if, in your judgment, they ARE getting the movements but you hear later on that you've conducted the class too fast and too advanced? And the student does not speak up during class?

Well, I am always constantly reminding my students to speak up. The first night of class I give a little talk about how I consider class to be a conversation, not a lecture; and that I can only know what they truly need from me if they ask me. I tell them that some classes will be faster or slower based on what I think they are ready for, but if they want more time drilling, or want to press on and add more more more, speak up. I consider my entire job to be there for THEM in any capacity they need me, and their job in return is to communicate.

Does that mean they always do? No You do have to learn to read, and part of that isn't just looking, but a *feeling*. Developing a strong sense of empathy for my class took time, but it is something I feel pride in: being able to read abilities and pace in a mixed group of dancers and be able to adapt accordingly. But, like I said, I encourage a lot of questions in my classes, and call out throughout lessons, "Are there any questions so far?" so I get a fair amount of feedback compared to classes I myself attended where teachers never asked and just pontificated "from on high" so students didn't feel empowered to ask questions.

I would say just tell them upfront that sometimes you will need to do hands-on correction. Put it in your terms and conditions to cover your butt legally, and if people want to take your class, then they can learn to deal. After all, this is dance. I don't see ballet teachers worrying if their students will be squeamish.



ps - I used to be one of those 'eww don't touch me' students myself, and it very much behooved me in the long run that my teachers didn't cater to it.

I'm a person that hates to have people I don't know really well touching me, but it doesn't bother me when my dance instructors do it, and I understand the value of it. I think it's helpful.

It's probably a good idea, as others have mentioned, to let students know upfront that this is how you teach, though.

Regarding some of your other questions: as a student, sometimes I can only focus on one thing at a time, when I'm learning something new. If I'm focusing on footwork or hip work, for example, I may not have my arms held perfectly. Once I get what I'm focusing on, then my poor, wee brain is free to concentrate on getting the arms (or whatever) right.

I like it if the instructor demonstrates the correct way and lets me know if something isn't right, but maybe not expect me to have everything just right the first day I'm learning the step. If I'm still having trouble the second or third time we try it, then by all means, I hope she'll get on my case.

That depends a bit on level, too. I'm not in beginner classes, so I think the teacher can justifiably be pickier right off the bat. However, if I'm learning a different style or something that's quite new to me, I want t a little more time to get it myself.

Originally Posted by Azhia

Related to this...are you laissez-faire and allow a student to struggle for a short time before correcting? Or are you constantly on top of her/him, ensuring they get it right the first time?

Do you leave those who are clearly understanding and brilliant alone and let them do their thing in favour of those who are not?

Do you correct EVERY student who is doing some LITTLE thing wrong or let it slide in the interest of making sure the entire class gets it generally correct?

That reminds me of the legally blind Mary Ellen Donald telling a story about Bert Baladine and how he had to put her hands on his hips and shoulders to teach her the moves.