Thread: Working hard to show you're not working hard

There's been a lot of talk on some threads about Codes, and Styles, and dancing like an Egyptian.

There are two questions I get asked a lot when I dance. First is, where are you from? Second, how do you make that look so easy?

The people who ask where I'm from are usually Middle Eastern, and they think I'm from the Middle East myself. This has to do partly with the fact that I'm dark, but mostly they think I dance with very little western accent. This is, for me, the highest accolade I can get with regards to my dancing, and it makes me very humble.

The second question of how do you make it look to so easy is another heartening thing to hear, because this is one of the most important factors of dancing without an accent. Making each movement powerful yet languid, strong yet soft, big yet small. And it's hard hard work. Driving those muscles within a strong, powerhouse core, whilst allowing the rest of the body to be soft and relaxed takes some doing. I sweat when I dance...really sweat.... because the effort of appearing effortless is not easy. It does take years of training, but also it's something that comes from within.

When I watch some dancers I see the almost desperate energy being expended and it spoils their performance. Moves are executed to within an inch of their lives, and are crammed into choreographies so frenetic that the watcher feels as though they've actually watched nothing but a blur. There are no allowances for visual 'digestion'.

So how important is it to you to show you are not working hard, whilst dancing your guts out?

I think that it's really important to look like dancing is the most natural thing in the world. Except for the shimmy marathon, where you can add the 'look at this, I'm doing all these complicated moves layered over a shimmy!' look.

There's also the question about making it look too easy. The audience want to be in awe, but if you dance as if you're walking in the park, there's no tension and intention in your moves. Your audience will then believe that you look effortless because you're not dancing hard engouh.

A balance between the two is important.

Originally Posted by mekyria

I think that it's really important to look like dancing is the most natural thing in the world. Except for the shimmy marathon, where you can add the 'look at this, I'm doing all these complicated moves layered over a shimmy!' look.

There's also the question about making it look too easy. The audience want to be in awe, but if you dance as if you're walking in the park, there's no tension and intention in your moves. Your audience will then believe that you look effortless because you're not dancing hard engouh.

A balance between the two is important.

Yes it is. But there's a big difference between dancing effortlessly and being a lazy so and so. I don't believe an audience will believe your not dancing hard enough if the inner energy is reined in enough to show this. It's when there's no energy at all that it becomes laughable.

I like this discussion - I love the way the dance is about using a whole pile of energy and not showing it, but learning to control and manipulate it. Loved the reference to the "shimmy marathon" where the effort is expressed. Reminded me a little of when I dance with a sword. Most of the time I am in control and look as though I am in control (I hope!). But I do tend to appear a littel scared/let the sword go a bit wobbly at the start just to build up the tension a bit more.

Kharis your hips are totally exquisite (gush, creep lol!) so I'm not surprised that you've been complimented in this way. And I know about effort where you are concerned, having had a private lesson or two with you in the past. You nearly killed me lol!

Yep - for me it's about energies and the manipulation/.use of them. I have had lazy moments but not many. The music always gets me in the end. But it doesn't look effortless most of the time I suspect - partly because of the overabundance of perspiration! Someone pass me a tissue lol

There's nothing worse than the Limp Lettuce Brigade. Totally insipid, ineffectual dancers who you want to put a rocket up their arse. I mean, come on, feel the music, let it inside, summon up some life.

We all have 'off' days where we cannot summon any enthusiasm and dance rather badly, but when you're a professional you've just got to bring it on from somewhere. That old cheesy chestnut, "smile when your heart is breaking' is very true when it comes to being an entertainer.

I remember getting ready once for a gig, feeling totally run down and lethargic, and my brother laughed his head off when, after enquiring why I was so glum, I explained I had to go 'smile at people' for the twenty minute duration of my set.
Jeez, I had to do this after I lost my mum. I remember having to gig a couple of days after she died and I just felt like throwing myself across the dance floor and screaming blue murder. LOL. I'm not sure where the inner resources came from but it was partly through being able to totally immerse myself in the music.

Originally Posted by Freddie

Kharis your hips are totally exquisite

Thank you. Some seasoned Egyptian guy once said my hips had been blessed by Allah. I remember being torn between suspecting he was a lechy old git and feeling complimented.

The secret to mobile hips, in my opinion, is totally relaxing them whilst underpinning them with strong muscular movements from other sources. This is one of my gripes about when people try to teach the Egyptian Walk. So many students try to wobble the hips from the hips, when in fact, the movement comes from the legs. They end up moving like crippled ducks.

Originally Posted by kharis_UK

So how important is it to you to show you are not working hard, whilst dancing your guts out?

this is one of the hallmarks of a pro, imo. its part of what keeps the "magic" and showmanship alive for the audience.

and so is putting on your game face despite very difficult life situations. sorry you had to go through that. but it is impressive that the show did go on

this is what i think is the real secret of egyptian dance - it inspires me to think simultaneously, that looks so easy and how does she do that........and I mean absolutely simultaneously in the same movement

spot on JencUK x

Originally Posted by jencUK

this is what i think is the real secret of egyptian dance - it inspires me to think simultaneously, that looks so easy and how does she do that........and I mean absolutely simultaneously in the same movement

It should flow, like good conversation. Nothing worse than speaking to someone in short staccato blasts or halting bad grammar or non stop prattling. Dance is a language.

you want to put a rocket up their arse.

As a troupe director..that thought has occured to me on several occasions! Would that be a bottle rocket for sustained energy, or a cherry bomb as a wake up call?

Originally Posted by anala

you want to put a rocket up their arse.

As a troupe director..that thought has occured to me on several occasions! Would that be a bottle rocket for sustained energy, or a cherry bomb as a wake up call?

Any kind of rocket. In fact, any kind of implement that might induce some energy.

I am from the Wild West...I think I have a cattle prod around here somewhere! YYYYEEEEE HHAAAA !!!! Get along little dawggie!

I think it is important that an audience member feel that I am making the effort to entertain them (but that that isn’t a horrible task to undertake), but there is balance between that entertainer perception and with giving them the feeling that I truly enjoy the dance, performing, and am confident enough that I know what I am doing and that I don’t need them to constantly show me that they are enjoying me.

Part of entertaining folks is being able to present complex and subtle moments that impress (be it due to movement, technique, musicality, artistry or the raw “on my god a body can do that?” ness ) without giving the impression that these movements are at the threshold of one’s ability...even if they are. It’s ok if the audience thinks “Wow, how does she do that?!” but I'd rather they not think “Oh, thank goodness she did that, it was pretty touch and go there…she almost didn’t make it!”…with the possible exception of balancing stuff which has that tension built into those props.

When I watch someone, I don’t want to get the impression that a dancer might be struggling with a move, or mentally and physically fumbling around for something, or is just about to get wear herself plum out! That’s exhausting for me to see.

I think a lot of insecure dancers don’t get the idea that a quiet audience isn’t always a bored audience, or that a well executed simple move, if presented well, has the power to captivate and inspire. It takes more confidence to play it slow and simple and not throw everything at an audience in hopes of “keeping them” and “getting positive reactions to feed off of”. Dancers who blitzkrieg everything are tiring to watch because they fling so much information out to the audience and because it is often very clear that they are expending a ton of energy to do so. At their worst they give off an exhausting, needy, brittle, and frenetic vibe.

That being said, I do enjoy moments where dancers show audiences that they KNOW they are doing something pretty damned cool/complex/hard/awe-inspiring with a well placed hand to frame a motion, some gaze directing, and a sly smile or whatever. It’s ok for a dancer to humorously acknowledge that she’s sweating buckets and then show us that she’s just gonna shake that off and continue with the show..…but that’s different from a dancer looking like she’s about to expire.

Bored looking dancers suck. Period. Looking calm and serene ain’t the same thing. Calm and serene moments, internal moments in general, can give audiences a chance to relax and recharge (or eat)… looking bored insults the audience and everyone else involved.

Originally Posted by anala

I am from the Wild West...I think I have a cattle prod around here somewhere! YYYYEEEEE HHAAAA !!!! Get along little dawggie!

If you work with breeding bulls and stallions you might be able to get your hands on a Rectal Electroejaculator...which seems like the sort of thing, if labled clearly and in large type, you might need only to wield in a menacing fashion.

,r:; <- the smile of someone who has a few too many minutes of free internet time today at work.

Uh...and here I thought that other thread took a wrong turn a few pages back. ,r:;

Zahra talked about "efficiency of movement" yesterday, which is a very important skill that is only honed after many, many years of dancing (due to both physical and mental conditioning). I think this relates to the skill you describe Kharis, and agree that it is the essence of Egyptianness in dance. Either way, 'tis a beautiful thing to see!

Originally Posted by kharis_UK

It should flow, like good conversation. Nothing worse than speaking to someone in short staccato blasts or halting bad grammar or non stop prattling. Dance is a language.

Conversation is a brilliant analogy for me. I was taught in public speaking to "use" the pause, variations in pace, volume and emphasis, when to use humour and when not to etc, and it all translates perfectly into pretty much any kind of performance I've had to do.

Yeah non-stop prattling - done that kind of dance a few times lol ...

Originally Posted by Freddie

Conversation is a brilliant analogy for me. I was taught in public speaking to "use" the pause, variations in pace, volume and emphasis, when to use humour and when not to etc, and it all translates perfectly into pretty much any kind of performance I've had to do.

Yeah non-stop prattling - done that kind of dance a few times lol ...

Conversation is exactly how I would describe it. My teacher was Arabic and she was always stressing that the dancer is just another instrument in the orchestra and that we are having a conversation with each other.

You can see this clearly if you watch an Arabic band perform. Sometimes one instrument is talking and another answer's back, sometimes they all talk back and forth.

[ame=http://youtube.com/watch?v=RwXGBxBcdJw]YouTube - abdel Halim hafez: Qariat el Fingan 1976[/ame]

Originally Posted by Freddie

Conversation is a brilliant analogy for me. I was taught in public speaking to "use" the pause, variations in pace, volume and emphasis, when to use humour and when not to etc, and it all translates perfectly into pretty much any kind of performance I've had to do.

Yeah non-stop prattling - done that kind of dance a few times lol ...

Yes, I agree the pause is so effective, and so is using your inner energy and basically pushing it out through your skin so to speak, it is very powerful you can be doing an internal based movement yet reach the people in the back of the room!! And variation in energy levels, speeds of movement, 1/2 time, then a double time, all that comes with years of practice and of course feeling the music!

you might be able to get your hands on a Rectal Electroejaculator...

I will see if I can borrow my next door neighbor's..I am sure she wont mind.

Originally Posted by ozma

I think it is important that an audience member feel that I am making the effort to entertain them (but that that isn’t a horrible task to undertake), but there is balance between that entertainer perception and with giving them the feeling that I truly enjoy the dance, performing, and am confident enough that I know what I am doing and that I don’t need them to constantly show me that they are enjoying me.

Part of entertaining folks is being able to present complex and subtle moments that impress (be it due to movement, technique, musicality, artistry or the raw “on my god a body can do that?” ness ) without giving the impression that these movements are at the threshold of one’s ability...even if they are. It’s ok if the audience thinks “Wow, how does she do that?!” but I'd rather they not think “Oh, thank goodness she did that, it was pretty touch and go there…she almost didn’t make it!”…with the possible exception of balancing stuff which has that tension built into those props.

When I watch someone, I don’t want to get the impression that a dancer might be struggling with a move, or mentally and physically fumbling around for something, or is just about to get wear herself plum out! That’s exhausting for me to see.

These are some great points, the one thing to remember is know your audience, westerners vs ME people are two very different audiences, not that they don't both appreciate the dance, but non Arabic people who don't understand the music tend to need more energy, unless, like you said you are showing off an awesome hard move, then everyone is impressed.
I remember a Turkish party where Omar Faruk and some other musicians were playing, and the dancer was a beautiful dancer, very Egyptian and well trained, but it wasn't their cup of tea, and the party members pushed her off the dance floor and back into her dressing room basically,.w.: because she couldn't dance to the Turkish music correctly, I felt bad for her, but that's where knowing your audience comes in real handy!!!! The Turks like to rock out!! Especially back then, this was late 80's early 90's, now everything has mushed together..c:: Of course dancing for other dancers is a whole other animal in itself, that could be another thread altogether..l;, ..l;,

Also keep in mind your space that you have to dance in, a small restaurant, or that huge stage at the old Rakkasah location....

Well, someone once told me, and I think we had a thread about this long ago, that sometimes there is almost a feeling to Egyptian dance that the dancer is off the beat. An almost, it's to hot to race over there! feeling.

Once again, as Bea says, it's hitting the T on beat.

{{{HUGS}}}