Thread: Making it Egyptian - use of energy

Originally Posted by jencUK

It's like when you sing along to music in the car, doing all the backing vocals and even some of the musical refrains, or drumbeats out loud. No one would want to listen to you do that, would they. Ok in my case that would be a horrible noise as well, but even if I had a fantastic voice - that would still be horrible.

Great analogy!! I'm stealing that for use with my own students.

Thanks for reviving the thread and posting that clip. Looking at the 3 dancers all together, I'm much happier now with my own "subdued" style, which I was sort of worried about before. Cool :)

Originally Posted by aziyade

Great analogy!! I'm stealing that for use with my own students.

Thanks for reviving the thread and posting that clip. Looking at the 3 dancers all together, I'm much happier now with my own "subdued" style, which I was sort of worried about before. Cool :)

Glad someone was helped by the video. Of course, I realize that they are not dancing in different styles, but rather with different energy and ability levels, the dancers being a teacher and her students, but the result is the same.

I'm having a bit of a struggle with this right now... I love performing, and my natural instinct is to throw myself out there and connect with the crowd, and that big OOMPH of energy is a natural part of Bollywood dance, which I also do. I love the theatrical aspects of dance, so when I'm doing Bollywood or a fusion piece, I use my energy differently.

But this past year, I've tried to focus on making my bellydance movements tighter, more controlled, and specifically more Egyptian. The problem is, apparently this doesn't always translate well to the GP? My troupe leader has now instructed me to focus on making my movements bigger, more "visible" so I don't get lost among the rest of the troupe.

Argh. It's been a challenge, to say the least. I understand that it's necessary to present differently to some audiences, and that troupes need their movements to synchronize, but a part of me wishes we could take it the other direction instead -- more give-and-take use of energy instead of BOOM, out there energy.

I guess that's just a stylistic preference of the troupe I'm in... and I'm wondering if others have found that non-ME audiences want bigger, flashier movements too?

Originally Posted by *Shira*

Yeah, yeah, I know that there are other explanations for the *one specific situation* I described. But I've seen many, many examples of what I described with respect to Eastern vs Western uses of energy, and this one situation was particularly useful for making the point because it removed music and choroegraphy as variables. So there wasn't a difference in music or movement vocabulary to distract from the point.

My husband and I have been watching old musicals on DVD (we watched Singin' in the Rain the other night), and the Western aesthetic of blasting energy out of every pore is very apparent in those.

Hi Shira, just a quick comment to say how much I loved your comparison and I think it is very valid because you were able to remove some variables at least. I do some coaching nowadays for soloists who want to dance to "classic Egyptian Raks Sharki" and it is hard to get them to "just relax" as Fifi Abdo was telling us all at the Dallas workshop. And yes, the exact same choreography looks different even if the technique of the steps is essentially the same when the "energy" put into each step is either lower or higher. Great post!

From someone so far west, I'm almost in the East ;) (No, I can't see Russia from my window, but my friend in Little Diamede can!)

Anyway- I appreciate Shira's post, as well as Yasmin & others- I understand what you are talking about, I have observed similar, but I think there is a generational/trend thing going on too. My first instructor danced more like an old school Egyptian dancer than some of the modern Egyptian dancers- I fell in love with the subtlety and grace and playfulness, that same give & take of energy throughout a performance that you are talking about. It is so different from what I see in mainstream American Belly Dance, and she grew up in Alaska, just like I did, so it's not an inherently American thing, I think it is more a matter of regional trends and who is prominent in the teaching circuits. It is also partly what we see around us, so yes, culture affects us- bat that, too, goes in trends and cycles. As much as I like SYTYCD, the dances there are much more impact driven (and much shorter) than what I remember watching growing up (we actually lived where professional dancers helped lead social dancing at the jazz club!)

I can appreciate and enjoy modern American trend belly dancers (for lack of a better term!) but when I see someone dance like my original teacher, I just kind of sit back & sigh. THAT's what I fell in love with, and it feels like coming home.

I did grow up listening to this music, but it is not my native culture, I had no other connection to the culture which produced this dance form- where does that leave me in this melange?

I tended to be high energy, extroverted when I started- I was a shy 12, short and skinny with no hips to show off a shimmy, so I tended to overcompensate- but I loved it, and I was drawn to Turkish style, I think, partly because of that. I needed that flamboyant outlet. Much as I loved what my first teacher taught me, I had to go on my own journey as well. I still tend to be a little more extroverted, but I feel like I'm somewhere between styles. I do mix up what I understand as Turkish, Lebanese & Egyptian to suit who I am today. I've stolen a few tricks from my favorite American dancers too, but that style feels alien to me when I try to dance it, either in troupe choreographies or in workshops. I love to watch one of my friends who I think does this style well, and it is definitely a style that catches attention here. Sometimes I wonder if I would be more successful as a teacher or performer if I adopted something closer to her style, but then I realize that as much as I enjoy watching her, it isn't in me to dance that way, it wouldn't be sincere. All that being said, I think I am still too frantic in my own dancing when I perform. On my own, I can feel the music better, but I panic on stage (yes, even after all these years!) and hit things too hard. I am still trying to be more like my first teacher ;)

I will add, too, that even tho Turkish seems more outgoing/extroverted *in general,* it is still distinct from this American trend I've seen (and I just haven't seen many British/Aussie/New Zealand dancers, so I'm using Americans as reference because it's what I've experienced) It's still not articulating every beat of the music, there is still an ebb & flow of energy, and I think there is more playfulness, again *in general*

As with any general observation, it can be carried to extremes.

Originally Posted by outi

Mhh... all this Eastern/Western stuff
After all this time in Egypt I come to understand that there is only three kinds of people - Egyptian, Arabs and foreigners.
The same categories goes in other Arab countries, also.

I just wanted to add this is the same mentality even in Japan - Japanese and everyone else. :(



But to add, I may not have danced long but I have been in the arts and an artist for a long time, sing, and come from a musical family. This is just my opinion but, I think whether you know how to listen or feel music is based entirely how you were raised on music and also to certain kinds of music. People interrupt things differently depending on culture and society, I think. It's just a cultural difference.

And also I wouldn't say US persons largely use western/eastern in a derogatory sense. I'm sure wherever the writers are, they will use those words to define location. After awhile, those just become part of the language and are used in that sense. Personally, I'd call Australia/NZ Oceania. Because for me, it's neither defined as eastern or western. But that just how I was taught "this is eastern" "this is western". Maybe it's not right, so you can blame the educational system for that. :p

Also dancers should do what feels natural to them. If you are doing Egyptian but you look and feel more natural releasing more energy than Egyptians who dance, personally I think it would be better. As an audience member, I would rather see someone be natural than trying to be something else.


Ok thats my two cents! Good thread though!