Thread: Spin-off: Music Sharing

On the thread about student rates, someone mentioned that there are dancers who do not share their music.

I'm usually happy to share my music, except for when there are 50 dancers who are all doing the same routines, musically. Each one may interpret it differently, but I get tired of hearing the same songs over and over again. An example in my area would be Habibi Ya Eini, Nourhanne version. It was on the BDSS III album, so everyone and their sister had access to it, and it was rapidly played out.

I love this song and am guilty of using it quite a bit.

I hunted high and low for another song that could replace this one in my repertoire and finally found it. So far, I've only shared it with 2 people, but dunno if I would share it with others. Only because I don't want it to go the way of Habibi Ya Eini.

Any thoughts on the ethics of withholding, or sharing? Not in whether or not we should make copies of music and give it out, but whether people should share their music routines with others in their area?

That's an interesting issue. One I fortunately rarely had to deal with as I always worked with a live band and sometimes never knew what they would play. In the Greek clubs they had a limited number of routines they would use and they just interchanged them. We each had our favorites of course. In the Arabic clubs the songs available were endless if you had a good band.

I was however a house dance for several years and I did have a couple routines that I felt were "mine" as I specifically requested the songs and had the band learn them. Patrons would often request me to do a specific song that was my "speciality". Because of that most dancers in the area did not want to do "my music". However, I don't think I would have liked it very much if the band had played exactly the same mix for another dancer as they did for me. Especially the songs that I specifically requested them to learn even though I certainly didn't "own" any of it. And especially if I was dancing the same night!

I recently however heard from a couple of dancers in 2 different states that they are having the problem you are experiencing. One did say she will no longer share music with the locals. I guess everybody loves a good song. If you discover it, chances are someone else will as well. I really don't know how you can keep it to yourself for long.

I would say however that if you did share your music with another dancer, and it was music that she knew you frequently used than she should have the respect and consideration not to use it at any event or club where you would perform together.

Hi Kina. I think I've mentioned to you once how some dancers I've known don't like to share their music. This is why I was so appreciative when you offered to share one of your drum solos with me! I have no problem sharing music that's widely available, but if I have a piece that is a little hard to come by, I'm careful who I'll share it with. It's not that I want to be greedy, it's just, as you mentioned, some pieces of music (or entire CDs) get overplayed and it's nice to have something that's uniquely yours. I remember when Amar 13 (Jililah's first CD) came out. It seemed like EVERYONE was dancing to all those tracks. And who could blame them? They're all so good!! But after a while, it got boring to see yet another performance to it.

I have no problem sharing my music, however, I know LOTS of dancers who don't. I don't mind sharing - I don't own the music.....

I love music and am always glad to share it.

Hi, ..l;,

I was the one who mentioned a lady not sharing the name of a song she danced to. I was so surprised when she wouldn't share the name of the song b /c we had been in the same bd class for several years together and she KNOWS that I don't dance (accept at my house) and only listen to ME music for pleasure. I couldn't understand her reasoning for that and it hurt my feelings more than anything. ..c:: For someone not to share the title of a song is down right selfish. You don't have to share the artist b/c you can search and find several versions of one song.
I apologize if I have hurt any feelings in my saying so but that is the way I feel on this issue. I would personally bend over backward to help someone find a piece of music they enjoyed listening too.

I can understand wanting to keep a song for yourself, but I think it's important to share who you dance to, if people ask. It provides free publicity for the musician, which in turn can create another person buying the CD/song and thus increasing the market. In my optimistic view, that would mean there would be more music, so there wouldn't be so many repeats of routines done to the same song.

I think this also goes back to being more community minded in your outlook.
It's not like the music was specifically written for you, the cd's are out there for everyone to buy.

Originally Posted by Michelle75

Hi, ..l;,

I was the one who mentioned a lady not sharing the name of a song she danced to. I was so surprised when she wouldn't share the name of the song b /c we had been in the same bd class for several years together and she KNOWS that I don't dance (accept at my house) and only listen to ME music for pleasure. I couldn't understand her reasoning for that and it hurt my feelings more than anything. ..c:: For someone not to share the title of a song is down right selfish. You don't have to share the artist b/c you can search and find several versions of one song.
I apologize if I have hurt any feelings in my saying so but that is the way I feel on this issue. I would personally bend over backward to help someone find a piece of music they enjoyed listening too.

No worries on the hurt feelings here, Michelle! It sparked some thought for me. I will always give out the name of the song if I have it, sometimes I don't have the title. I also suffer from something known on bhuz as "spillers disease" which includes inability to keep things un-spilled, inability to get anywhere with any kind of cogent directions and re-naming things, also insatiable lust for sparkly items, sometimes mis-diagnosed as magpie syndrome. ..g.:

But as I mentioned, sometimes music gets overplayed. I like having stuff I enjoy dancing to, it makes me happy to be there. I hate when I'm the 3rd dancer on that night and it'll be the 3rd time somebody has danced to that song. I'd like to know the community at large's thoughts on this as well, is it ethical?

Aazura, as I said to you at the time, I don't care if other people use the same music, just don't want it on the same show! ..l;,

i share everything. i come from a school where they didnt, and i always hated that. "oh teacher, what music is that" "i cant tell you because it is in the show we are working on and we never share the music from our current production". bull****.

the music is out in the public domain, it's not *yours*. yes, i'd feel weird when i would then see someone using "my" music. but you can hope people are polite about that and wait a little, dont use it when you are performing at the same venue, but even when they dont, really, it isnt "mine" anyway... and hopefully people create their own interpretation.

besides, if people want to know the source of the music, i tend to take it as a compliment.

and if it's something not so well known, that i love, well, isnt it great to be able to support the artist by encouraging others to buy his/her music too!

Artemisia

It's always been one of my great joys in life to introduce someone to music they haven't heard before, whether it's obscure Elvis or Dylan or Middle Eastern music, because I know how thrilled I am when I first hear a great song, especially when it's one that's been around forever and I just never heard it. I can't imagine not telling what a song is-- actually it would be kind of embarrassing because it makes it seem like I don't know the title or artist, and sometimes that is actually the case with ME music and I hate that. For instance I have used a great drum solo numerous times that I was told recently by someone is called 'Turboleki' (not sure of the spelling or if that's even correct) but they also did not know the artist and I feel kind of dumb performing it in shows where there is a program and I am unable to provide the info as to what it is. So if I do know I say so.

Furthermore- aside from that song which happens to be a perfect 1:30 short drum solo which is hard to find, I usually never perform the same song twice in shows, except at the restaurant when it's whatever the DJ throws on. Since I improvise anyway I prefer to pick a new song each time and 'try' to pick things I don't think anyone else is going to show up with.

So is your real issue, not so much the "sharing" but everyone using the same song in the same show? That to me is a different issue and easily preventable by communication. The last show I was in, the organizer had everyone submit the name of the song they were using to prevent repeats. First come, first served basis.

If that's not possible, always have a couple of back-ups so you aren't in the position of being the 3rd dancer that night to the same song.

I guess that's one reason why I really avoid the most popular music and have a tendency to pick really difficult complicated music that few dancers would choose. I like those obscure CD's that people don't talk about!

Originally Posted by norma

So is your real issue, not so much the "sharing" but everyone using the same song in the same show? That to me is a different issue and easily preventable by communication. The last show I was in, the organizer had everyone submit the name of the song they were using to prevent repeats. First come, first served basis.

If that's not possible, always have a couple of back-ups so you aren't in the position of being the 3rd dancer that night to the same song.

I guess that's one reason why I really avoid the most popular music and have a tendency to pick really difficult complicated music that few dancers would choose. I like those obscure CD's that people don't talk about!

I think you've hit it, Norma! And wonderful suggestions, as well. The problem is finding the great, obscure cd's!!

If someone asks what I am dancing to, I definitely share the info!

I agree with Norma--hearing the same song over and over is annoying. I try not to use trendy or newer or overplayed songs in belly dance community festivals or events. Love the idea of a back-up CD in situations where repeats may be unavoidable.

My own solutions are:

1) Go backwards. Find old stuff that is still strong and bring it back! Of course I admit that I still listen to records and cassettes...there are some gems on those! I have found with any genre of music (or with authors, or filmmakers...) it is interesting to find out who influenced them and go explore their work...and on and on! That is how I have discovered some of my favorite artists.

or

2) When possible, choose live music over canned!

My first teacher would never tell us the names of the songs we used in class. She would always say : it is an import ...then i find a few songs on Nourhan vol.1 and then a couple of pieces from Omar Faurk. not that hard to find when you have the internet. I was just a begginer student wanting to practice at home, not a dancer dancing in the same restaurant as her.
I made a promise to myself to tell the name of the song whenever i could. sometimes, it comes from cds we get in workshops and i know it is hard to identify. but when i know i tell.

What i really dont like is the lack of originality of many dancers. For example, when the dvd of BD superstars came out, do you know how many people would write or call me to ask me the cd with the music that Amar danced to with her wings? ( I am a vendor) they all wanted to do Isis wings to the same song.
I choose a piece of music to dance to because it moves me or inspires me , not because i want to reproduce something another dancer made... I can ask a dancer what song she used if the music touches me but wont use it the same way.

Maybe it isn't a matter of wanting to recreate that act but wanting to use Isis wings and not knowing what other music goes with it?

I wish my classes on a whole would do like music education/appreciation more.

What makes me crazy is dancers who appear to be "lazy" about music. Rather than going out and doing some research, asking friends for recommendations, dropping some bucks on compilations... they just see a performance at a show and decide that's the tune they want to dance to.

I understand that sometimes everybody gets really excited about a piece of music... but I think dancers should use their brains and say, "Hmm, everybody is talking about this music... perhaps there is something ELSE by this artist that is good?" Or how about: "So and so's troupe performed to this cut at the workshop show and again at the fair. Obviously they intend to keep dancing to it for a while. So I should set it aside for now and get it out in a few years when they don't do that choreo any more."

I very much appreciate it when dancers tell me what they were dancing to, because I like to buy the album and listen to the rest of it. But I understand if they want to keep it their baby for a while... I don't get mad if they say "it was custom mixed for me" or "I forget which version this is".

Originally Posted by kina

But as I mentioned, sometimes music gets overplayed. I like having stuff I enjoy dancing to, it makes me happy to be there. I hate when I'm the 3rd dancer on that night and it'll be the 3rd time somebody has danced to that song. I'd like to know the community at large's thoughts on this as well, is it ethical?

In this instance, the problem isn't with the dancers using the same music, it's with the organizer not requiring participants to let him/her know what music they will use in performance prior to the event. I make song information a part of my event programs, so if a dancer doesn't get the information to me, he or she simply doesn't dance.

In haflas where pre-sign up is not required, I agree with those who say: always have a back up song to use if your first choice has already been used.

Originally Posted by tigerb

What makes me crazy is dancers who appear to be "lazy" about music. Rather than going out and doing some research, asking friends for recommendations, dropping some bucks on compilations... they just see a performance at a show and decide that's the tune they want to dance to.

I agree. I usually give honest answers when people ask me where I got my music, because I've been so grateful for the many honest answers I've received over the years when I've asked other people where they got their music. It's my way of giving back.

But after a while, you get to know who the "pills" are, the people who are indeed "lazy" about creating their own personal touch. I do tend to withhold from these people stuff like who designed my costume, which music I used, where I bought my prop, where I learned certain cool step combinations, etc. In 26 years of dancing, I haven't had more than 5-6 such people, and there aren't any in my current community. So I don't worry about it too much.

Originally Posted by norma

I guess that's one reason why I really avoid the most popular music and have a tendency to pick really difficult complicated music that few dancers would choose. I like those obscure CD's that people don't talk about!

For similar reasons I've become somewhat obsessed with drum solos with unusual rhythms like 7/8 or samai or khaleegi. Sometimes it feels like everybody is dancing to the same handful of drum solos over and over and over in my area, and I want to do something different.

I have nothing against sharing what my music is--I'd like artists and labels to sell lots of cds or mp3s and make loads of money so that they can keep on making music. Though I'll admit when somebody asks me about a song, I mentally stamp it with an expiration date

Originally Posted by badriya_al_ahmar

For similar reasons I've become somewhat obsessed with drum solos with unusual rhythms like 7/8 or samai or khaleegi. Sometimes it feels like everybody is dancing to the same handful of drum solos over and over and over in my area, and I want to do something different.

I have nothing against sharing what my music is--I'd like artists and labels to sell lots of cds or mp3s and make loads of money so that they can keep on making music. Though I'll admit when somebody asks me about a song, I mentally stamp it with an expiration date

Can you say Sahra Saeeda? ..g.:

But the reasons that things become overplayed, imo, is that they have good rhythms, are funt, etc. Sigh.

[QUOTE=Monica;27148]
"1) Go backwards. Find old stuff that is still strong and bring it back! Of course I admit that I still listen to records and cassettes...there are some gems on those! I have found with any genre of music (or with authors, or filmmakers...) it is interesting to find out who influenced them and go explore their work...and on and on! That is how I have discovered some of my favorite artists."

Go backwards! Absolutely! That's how I always came up with "new" music. I'd listen to old cassettes or, hahem, LP's back in the day and rediscover something old.

It's so easy to do now. So many of those oldies are being re-released on CD. There is so much music out there. There is no reason for everyone to be dancing to the same thing.

In reading posts it seems like so many people are caught up in little tiny worlds like the BDSS. Believe me, much of the music they picked in the first 2 CD's are old original classics. There was a belly dance life before BDSS.

I've been to a few classes and workshops where I'd ask the teacher "what's the name of that song?" and they'd say "oh, my friend made the disk for me, I'm not sure." I always believed them but now I wonder if it's just a lie...

I agree though! It is annoying to hear the same song over and over again and see the same steps...

I personally will never dance to something like, say, the Gamal Gomaa drum solo that Aziza danced to on one of the IAMED DVDs. Grrr I just cringe every time I hear that drum solo, and anyway no one can do it like Aziza.

Honestly, I'm cool with sharing my music. Half the time though, I don't even know the title...if I do know the title I don't know the artist!!!

I will share my music, but I will also ask them not to dance to it until after I perform to it at "such and such show". I also make sure not to use other's music if I know they have a routine they haven't finished with yet.
But there are always the times (just last month for example) that I end up dancing to music that has already been played 4 dancers ahead of me. Oh well.... smile and have fun anyway.
Cassiopeia

Like a few years back I did a hafla show. I used a song i liked.(popular at hte time) The second set another dancer used the same song. But the number was totally different in style and performance than mine. And sometimes these haflas you never know what another dancer is using. But even though the same song was played. 2 different ways of performing it. that's okay.
and like on the radio one person likes the song and the radio stations will play it over and over, same thing with bd music. what gets me is there is so much bd music out there, why limit to BDSS and other favorites and classics, we hear all the time. Great music that is why it is repeated .But variety is the spice of life.
Just please not the chicky song...
Alrana