Thread: What makes it Shaabi? Discuss!!

If you have taken a workshop with a knowledgeable instructor would you share what you learned? What is Shaabi, what makes it shaabi, whats NOT shaabi?

Ready, set, go.......l;,

Ok, I'm lucky to study for Lena Helt who is probably one of the most knowledgeable in shaabi (you should really have her in the US!!! and take me along....;) )

For me shaabi is attitude, attitude attitude! You need to bring out your acting skills. There are different styles of shaabi, but common is the attitude, real sassy, cheeky, rough but with lot's of humour.

Also shaabi for me is heavy, earthy and quite sloppy. Not techniqually polished, don't get me wrong, you need lot's of technique, but the appearence can not be the polished, perfect orientalelook.

Most of the shaabi I've seen around isn't doing it for me. Way too sweet, too light/balletish and lacking of that proper attitude. I'd say shaabi is probably one of the most difficult styles to emulate.

Originally Posted by katja

Ok, I'm lucky to study for Lena Helt who is probably one of the most knowledgeable in shaabi (you should really have her in the US!!! and take me along....;) )

For me shaabi is attitude, attitude attitude! You need to bring out your acting skills. There are different styles of shaabi, but common is the attitude, real sassy, cheeky, rough but with lot's of humour.

Also shaabi for me is heavy, earthy and quite sloppy. Not techniqually polished, don't get me wrong, you need lot's of technique, but the appearence can not be the polished, perfect orientalelook.

Most of the shaabi I've seen around isn't doing it for me. Way too sweet, too light/balletish and lacking of that proper attitude. I'd say shaabi is probably one of the most difficult styles to emulate.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I love Shaabi. It really suits my body type and style of dancing. For me it's got to look effortless and feel natural. For me, Fifi epitomises this style. Though I would disagree that it's not technically polished... I feel it is, but has a rougher shine.

Sha'abi really just means "of the people." In the context of music and dance, when Arab people are talking about "sha'abi" they are generally talking about a music style, not a dance form. The use of "sha'abi" to refer to a dance style is, I think, pretty recent; this usage comes out of the dance community and is referring to essentially beledi-style dance done to sha'abi music. So while Arab dancers may talk about "sha'abi dance" (especially now that it is a hot money-making commodity), most "regular" Arabs wouldn't.

I also want to add that there are different sha'abi musical traditions in different Arab cultures, but when dancers talk about sha'abi music, they are generally talking about Egyptian sha'abi music.

Originally Posted by nisaasaintlouis

Sha'abi really just means "of the people." In the context of music and dance, when Arab people are talking about "sha'abi" they are generally talking about a music style, not a dance form. The use of "sha'abi" to refer to a dance style is, I think, pretty recent; this usage comes out of the dance community and is referring to essentially beledi-style dance done to sha'abi music. So while Arab dancers may talk about "sha'abi dance" (especially now that it is a hot money-making commodity), most "regular" Arabs wouldn't.

I also want to add that there are different sha'abi musical traditions in different Arab cultures, but when dancers talk about sha'abi music, they are generally talking about Egyptian sha'abi music.

Yes, I'm familiar with the Morroccan style and I recently saw something on youtube that said Yemeni Shabi and it was totally different sounding as well. I'm still trying to wrap my mind around this style of music.

The reason I ask is b/c the Orit video I posted the other day where she is dancing to Fakerni, someone underneath the video responded it was a nice Shaabi dance. It struck me at that moment I wouldn't know Shaabi if I was watching it.

So, from the several posts above I'm imagining that it can be done to baladi style music or pop music and you just need to have attitude. I'm really still not understanding it fully. ..c::..l;,

Originally Posted by katja

Ok, I'm lucky to study for Lena Helt who is probably one of the most knowledgeable in shaabi (you should really have her in the US!!! and take me along....;) )

For me shaabi is attitude, attitude attitude! You need to bring out your acting skills. There are different styles of shaabi, but common is the attitude, real sassy, cheeky, rough but with lot's of humour.

Also shaabi for me is heavy, earthy and quite sloppy. Not techniqually polished, don't get me wrong, you need lot's of technique, but the appearence can not be the polished, perfect orientalelook.

Most of the shaabi I've seen around isn't doing it for me. Way too sweet, too light/balletish and lacking of that proper attitude. I'd say shaabi is probably one of the most difficult styles to emulate.

So Katja, I'm envisioning a melaya style dance with some hard core baladi moves as well. Yes?????

May I (kill this thread...,r:;) well I like this shaabi here by Norwegian dancer Helene Skaugen. I love her cheeky street flavour with the Mona-Said-prop...I don't know whether it's the thing or if I only believe it to be:
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mAk6BiZs8A&feature=channel_page]YouTube - Helene - Shaaby[/ame]

I love Tarik's shabbi style - especially the swagger in the intro!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giGSeb1Hgfs]YouTube - Egyptian Dance-Shabbi Choreog: Sa'ad il Sughir Abd lelah[/ame]

Yes,
agree about shaabi being too "floaty" many times performed...
some of the female versions are sugary sweet dallal bimbo-
not the strong(totally in control) and spirited woman I like to see.

Almost completely sure that Helene studied shaabi for Lena Helt b.t.w-sadly I couldn´t locate any clips with Lena or the group Scheherazade on YouTube.

Ooooo... SO agree with Lena being the grand "Shaabayya"of Sweden! I met her in Sweden wth David (who also studied with her) and got to see her peform at one of her student shows in Stockholm. Helene (clip from above) has also studied with Lena.
Lena is grounded and oh so sexy in her Shaabi, balancing on the line of naughty vs sophisticated.

And heres another fine dude doing Shaabi!
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzQw_yyMJTg"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzQw_yyMJTg[/ame]

Originally Posted by kharis_UK

Couldn't have said it better myself. I love Shaabi. It really suits my body type and style of dancing. For me it's got to look effortless and feel natural. For me, Fifi epitomises this style. Though I would disagree that it's not technically polished... I feel it is, but has a rougher shine.

Kharis, I sometimes have a hard time finding the right words in english

I know there is tons and tons of very difficult technique to shaabi, what I mean is that it for me can not look to much oriental it has to be rougher and relaxed, not so controlled.

Fifi is a great shaabi dancer, I totally agree on that!

Originally Posted by nisaasaintlouis

The use of "sha'abi" to refer to a dance style is, I think, pretty recent; this usage comes out of the dance community and is referring to essentially beledi-style dance done to sha'abi music. So while Arab dancers may talk about "sha'abi dance" (especially now that it is a hot money-making commodity), most "regular" Arabs wouldn't.

Maybe we have a different way of categorizing dance in US and Europe but beledi and shaabi are way different styles to me. Similar and I would say both shaabi music and dance derive from beledi, but they are still different styles.

Thanks for the clip Patrisha! You gotta admit David does an awesome shaby/beledi for an Indian from Norway! LOL!!

I think there is a misconception by some that shaby needs to have big movements or has to be done fast. I dance in the clubs in Egypt and my good friend Tamer is the most incredible shaby dancer I know. His movements are intricate with fantastic technique and often times slow and gooey like. Kinda like a male Dina I guess. He is amazing to watch, but it takes a lot (of Hashish and encouragement) in order to get him up to dance. But Egyptians in general don't tend to make big sloppy movements when they dance, so not sure where that idea for shaby comes from either.

Originally Posted by Michelle75

So, from the several posts above I'm imagining that it can be done to baladi style music or pop music and you just need to have attitude. I'm really still not understanding it fully. ..c::..l;,

Well OK this is complicated You can do different styles of shaabi, typical shaabi music for me is for example Saad, Hakim and Shaban. Adaweya is also sometimes considered shaabi.

Most of the music I think of as beledy I probably wouldn't use for shaabi but there's a lot of pop I would.

And there is definetly more to shaabi than just attitude. The attitude alone doesn't make it shaabi, although it a big part of it. I think the hardest thing with shaabi is being that most of the dancers today have really weak folkloric schooling they struggle with getting the body weight down and being able to create that right bounciness to it.

Originally Posted by Michelle75

So Katja, I'm envisioning a melaya style dance with some hard core baladi moves as well. Yes?????

Mileya can most sure be shaabi I'm not sure what you mean with hardcore baladi moves though.

Originally Posted by emma-bessa

Yes,
agree about shaabi being too "floaty" many times performed...
some of the female versions are sugary sweet dallal bimbo-
not the strong(totally in control) and spirited woman I like to see.

Almost completely sure that Helene studied shaabi for Lena Helt b.t.w-sadly I couldn´t locate any clips with Lena or the group Scheherazade on YouTube.

Emma, hearhear and we are working on the youtube thing, there isn't anything on Lena or us....yet.

And yes Helena has studied with Lena.

Originally Posted by patrisha

Ooooo... SO agree with Lena being the grand "Shaabayya"of Sweden! I met her in Sweden wth David (who also studied with her) and got to see her peform at one of her student shows in Stockholm. Helene (clip from above) has also studied with Lena.
Lena is grounded and oh so sexy in her Shaabi, balancing on the line of naughty vs sophisticated.

I like it naughty, or on the verge of naughty anyway. The thing is that sometimes the BD community just don't get the sexy, naughty aspect of shaabi. I know Dandash got a lot of critique when being in Sweden. She did a real street style shaabi that was quite naughty, and got a lot of critique for it. On the other hand she performed a perfect Om Kouthum and wonderful orientales. People just didn't get the context and styling of Shaabi.

Patrisha we actually spoke and bopped together that evening in Sweden...g.:

Katja - tell Lena I miss her and tell her to stop being camera shy... the world wants her to share her dancing with them! :)

Lena is definitely the authority on Shaabi (and among the authorities in Orientale and Egyptian stage folklore as well, but that's not what we're discussing so I'll leave that for later). I'd dare to say that any dancer with self-respect in Scandinavia has, is, or will study with Lena. The rest, well, I guess they dont have any self respect, huh? LOL.

Lena has turned out fabulous dancers, or contributed to dancers, that in turn have impacted the dance scenes around the world. I could go on forever because Lena's influence is felt thorughout the entire dance scenes of Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland...and she will most hopefully be coming to the US in near future.

Lena is one of the most generous, precise, motivating instructors I have ever studied with. She will push you as if there is no tomorrow and she will gush over you as if there was no yesterday. She is very much an Egyptian caught in a Swedish body with western language skills and methodology of teaching. She, along with maybe 10-20 other dancers, has set the standard for what EGYPTIAN dance in Scandinavia is.

Not only is Lena one of the most exceptional instructors I've had the pleasure to befriend and study from, but she's also probably one of the strongest performers I have ever seen - and she puts out dancers of the same quality and caliber as well. Helene and Katja being great examples of this. I remember being in Lena's classes and looking over at Katja thinking "oh god, I wish I could be her"...after having looked at Lena and have said the same thing of course... continuing down mostly the whole middle row of dancers in the room thinking the same about each one of them...Needless to say, I safely placed myself to the right side in the room - which has since become my "study" location whenever I take classes. Where's David? Up against the wall to the right of the instructor - because I got into the habit of hiding from Lena on that side in class lol! Man, I miss her classes and insight.

Katja, you describe shaabi prefectly. If you take Fifi and Lena and put them together - you'd need no other influence as a dancer in your lifetime....or something pretty close to that!

Shaabi to me is exactly what Katja said - because I can hear those exact words come out of Lena's mouth herself in my head lol :)

The problem with "fluff shaabi" is that most people confuse the dance style shaabi with the word shaabi with the wider definition of shaabi dancing. Second, even high level professional dancers in Egypt dont consider this dance style as "good enough" for them to express as it is intended to be - so they "class" it up with higher center, more visually technical stuff, orientale influences and tone down the attitude and expression - ALOT. In the click of Lena students I hung out with back in the day we used to think of those dancers as "afraid of the Shaabi monster". LOL. To project attitude and expression you have to give of yourself, engage yourself, open yourself to the audience. Not every dancer is comfortable doing this. Unfortunately. It's a dissarming, engaging, at times shocking, liberating and just a whole lot of fun with a dancer that can let loose and just GO for a saucy Shaabi without being hung up on what the social perception would be. She acts it out. She brings it. She has it broughten. And Lena will bring it for sure. Lena could make a Kathak dancer blush with her expressive eyes only, and at that point we're not even talking about her face, gestures, body language and projection.

Ok, that's it I am going to sit down and watch all the Lena footage I have... all 2 performances of it! *bitter* (read, I wish I'd videoed her back in the day!).

*pickets for more Lena videos in the world*
*rallys for all potential sponsors out there to book Lena*

Ok, so I'm going to do my best to do Shaabi justice

Center: low to medium high
Movements: big, strong
Stance: wider
Expression/attitude 1: you know you want it, you know you need it, you cant have it. But still, *glide hand down your body* you know you want it.
Expression/attitude 2: Im hot, let me show you how hot
Expression/attitude 3: balady-esque introversion for introspect
Expression/attitude 4: c*cktease
Expression/attitude 5: joyful, happy, spreading happiness and cheerfulness
Expression/attitude 6: playfully bantering with people and their social perceptions/restrictions
Expression/attitude 7: life experienced person (Fifi), thus casually comfortable with her/himself

Music 1: anything that sounds like it got recorded at 5 am at an outside coffeeshop in Cairo by jamming musicians that have partied all night....not really "refined" sounding. Like Adawaya, Hakim, Saad El Sughayyar, Rico.
Music 2: general pop music with an upbeat feel

Oh god, Dandash scared the bellydancer out of many people that night at Tante Åkes Krog back in the day. People went home and had a mental breakdown and a personality crisis after seeing her pull out all the stops in her show. It was a TRUE Egyptian experience with the whole Oum K, Street Shaabi, the fat rich Egyptian that got a lot of attention and tipped as if there was no tomorrow.... Thank GOD I have the whole show on video. I think my favorites were when she did fishface and when she ran from one side of the stage to the other - did a pivot turn and flicked her full circle black costume skirt up in the air so the WHOLE audience on that side of the stage got a clear glimpse of her BLACK SEQUINED BOYSHORTS and then kept on dancing as if nothing had happened. The faces on people were to die for.

True shaabi scares people. why? because it's a reflection of the more wild side of their persona. Actually, thats wrong. its a reflection of the more wild aspects to life and their stage persona, not THEIR own persona. People confuse that and think that if they act less than a princess on stage the audience will think less of them. We see the same issues with Melaya leff that usually turns into a boring mush of forced expression, 1/2 decent technique and otherwise discomfort displayed by the dancer.

One of the things I learned from Lena was: if you are going to do it, do it fullheartedly - or just dont do it at all. I think many morning subway commuters in Stockholm got the privelage of seeing me faaar up on the platform trying to get my shaabi expression in order after getting off of work. If we only could know what was going on in their heads, huh?

Shaabi, to me, is the ultimate display of confidence, ability and social skills and command of the audience by a dancer. Where as Oum K is the refined, emotional, poetry reflecting part of a dancer's identity. Shaabi is the ultimate test and testament to her or his ability to do his or her job. of course, that's my HUMBLE opinion, right? lol

Ok, one more post... here's a more recent example of my Shaabi.[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bodqcjtXplo]YouTube - Male Bellydancer DaVid of Scandinavia does Shaabi[/ame]

You may recognize some Saiidi, some Balady, some pure "HUH" and some typical DaVid-esque traits...Lena instills and emphasises great respect for the folkdance heritage of Egyptian dances in order to understand Egyptian dance AND in order to understand how to express Orientale.

Shaabi can also be used as an attitude on top of other styles - so...there are lots of options...

David you say it so well and you make me blush. Thanks for your kind word.

We are working on the getting-videos-up-on-youtube-thing so hopefully there will be some footage shortly.

And yes, Lena is all what you describe, and also one of the warmest, sweetest and funniest persons I've ever know.

Originally Posted by katja

David you say it so well and you make me blush. Thanks for your kind word.

We are working on the getting-videos-up-on-youtube-thing so hopefully there will be some footage shortly.

And yes, Lena is all what you describe, and also one of the warmest, sweetest and funniest persons I've ever know.

Oh, dont blush. Sings: you know I want it, you know I think its hot, I know I cant have it *you run your hand down your body* but, I still want it LOL sorry, couldnt resist. Dont thank me, just keep dancing and dont ever quit (and give us all the youtube clips you possibly can).

Yes, Lena is indeed a warm, sweet and funny person. She is generous to the bone. She ALWAYS fed me when I hung out at her place... and that says a lot... the way to a man's heart is through his belly...and Lena had my belly full AND moving those days. Lena's ways always reminded me of that cool younger, trendy, fun aunt we all wish we had. She just has so much passion for life and the dance. Ok, I have to stop talking about this now or else Im going to need to bring out the Kleenex box here.

*group hug*

Originally Posted by katja

Kharis, I sometimes have a hard time finding the right words in english

I know there is tons and tons of very difficult technique to shaabi, what I mean is that it for me can not look to much oriental it has to be rougher and relaxed, not so controlled.

Fifi is a great shaabi dancer, I totally agree on that!

I understand, yes. I love Shaabi music, tis my absolute favourite to dance to.

Originally Posted by david

Thank GOD I have the whole show on video. I think my favorites were when she did fishface and when she ran from one side of the stage to the other - did a pivot turn and flicked her full circle black costume skirt up in the air so the WHOLE audience on that side of the stage got a clear glimpse of her BLACK SEQUINED BOYSHORTS and then kept on dancing as if nothing had happened. The faces on people were to die for.

Haha,
yes I was there(my brother in law was singing for Dandash)and loved both her and Aidas confidence and juicy moves!
Can you imagine how shellshocked some of my fellow Hilal students was?

Originally Posted by emma-bessa

Haha,
yes I was there(my brother in law was singing for Dandash)and loved both her and Aidas confidence and juicy moves!
Can you imagine how shellshocked some of my fellow Hilal students was?

..l;,..l;,..l;,

Dandash is still doing fish faces? That cracked me up when I saw her in 2000.

This is a great thread! Thanks for starting it, Michelle.

Thank you so much for all of the input. I think I have a MUCH better understanding than I did coming in.

I love the videos too.

Oooo, this thread brings up a question I've been pondering. For female dancers, what kind of costuming so you think is best for a shabbi performance? It seems kind of a disconnect to do a street-style shabbi in an elegant costume - sort of like doing hip-hop in a ballroom gown.

Originally Posted by laura 2

Oooo, this thread brings up a question I've been pondering. For female dancers, what kind of costuming so you think is best for a shabbi performance? It seems kind of a disconnect to do a street-style shabbi in an elegant costume - sort of like doing hip-hop in a ballroom gown.

Yes this is a good question. When my troupe did shaaby we wore stage-style galibayas. We were doing Saiidi at the same performances so we wore a folkloric style costume that seemed to work well for both styles.