Thread: Hoop Dance fusion

So I got a really cool heavy hula hoop back in the fall. I've been working on developing a few tricks with it and learning some pretty cool moves. I want to learn more about it and it seems like bellydancing with a hoop is an obvious progression. Have any of you done anything with a hoop? What do you think? Where would be a good place to get some instruction? I've just been watching videos on youtube to learn more tricks.

I do belly-hoop fusion! I have done it at the restaurant I worked at, which is Egyptian. The manager loved loved loved it. I also did it while balancing candle tray on my head.

Sometimes I'm afraid I'm approaching becoming a one-woman circus, but it's fun, and as long as people like it, well...I'm having fun.

Honestly, I'm self taught, too, but there are really great teachers out there. I did purchase a Gaia yoga-hoop dvd ages ago (about 8 years ago) that helped me learn. I don't do a whole lot of "tricks" per se...I do arms, neck, body spins, and so forth....when you combine all that with shimmies, shoulder shimmies, hip drops, and undulations--well, you don't need anything else!!!

I attached a photo for you of me doing hoop with candle tray--oh, I do floorwork with the hoop, spinning hoop on knees & sitting back on feet while turning in a circle on my knees. (not the most flattering picture of me...but you get the drift)

Hehehehe, I thought that picture of you had you balancing a lamp in your hand too. It was just the angle that the picture was taken from.

Back to topic. I think Shimarella does hooping too. Maybe she will chime in as well.

Why hello there! LOL

Great picture, Sonja2!

So yes, I have been hooping up a storm over the last two years. I have been performing a lot this year: straight hooping and also (gasp!horror!) burlesque. I have not seriously worked on an actual bellydance/hoop routine for various reasons (including philosophical) but there are some nice ones to look at, here's my favourite:
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqBYLlGLs_g]YouTube - Hoop Trio: Unity, Adelaide & HoopCharmer[/ame]

Hoop-buying/making is quite addictive and there are tons of people/websites you can get pretty ones from. You'll figure out that you will want to size down and get a lighter hoop in order to do some of the other tricks.
www.tailspinhoops.com
* Tasty Hoops * - Home
Hoop Dance & Hula Hooping | Get In The Hoop With Hoopnotica
and that's just for starters.

I bet there's a class somewhere near you or at least a meet-up group to go play with. I highly recommend that! In the absence of all that, yes, youtube away! Look for Safire, Natasha and Caroleena to start. Also, Hoopnotica has 3 nice, very clearly detailed DVDs of basic moves and there is a book out about hooping.

Some of the isolations you need for hooping will be easy because of bellydancing. The rest is all about object manipulation. What bellydancing really helps with is when you are comfortable enough with the hoop to really rock out with it... you will have a huge advantage over hoopers who just stand there with their hands out and waist-hoop.

Let me know if there is anything else I can help you with ;)

Some of my hooping pix ( i don't have decent video yet)
S.T. Shimi - San Antonio, TX | Facebook
S.T. Shimi - San Antonio, TX | Facebook
S.T. Shimi - San Antonio, TX | Facebook
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S.T. Shimi - San Antonio, TX | Facebook

Originally Posted by Sonja2

I do belly-hoop fusion! I have done it at the restaurant I worked at, which is Egyptian. The manager loved loved loved it. I also did it while balancing candle tray on my head.

Sometimes I'm afraid I'm approaching becoming a one-woman circus, but it's fun, and as long as people like it, well...I'm having fun.

Honestly, I'm self taught, too, but there are really great teachers out there. I did purchase a Gaia yoga-hoop dvd ages ago (about 8 years ago) that helped me learn. I don't do a whole lot of "tricks" per se...I do arms, neck, body spins, and so forth....when you combine all that with shimmies, shoulder shimmies, hip drops, and undulations--well, you don't need anything else!!!

I attached a photo for you of me doing hoop with candle tray--oh, I do floorwork with the hoop, spinning hoop on knees & sitting back on feet while turning in a circle on my knees. (not the most flattering picture of me...but you get the drift)

geez woman, that's skill right there!

Hooping, HoopDance - San Francisco California Area | HoopGirl

This person has dvds for hooping that might be fun.

I actually just started taking hoop classes - tonight is my third. I LOVE it! I practice every day - learning the hoop takes me back in time when I first started taking belly dance classes and had no clue of what was going on. Every move (that now seems so simple) took awhile to get and do it right. That is what I am experiencing now, and I haven't felt it for a long time.

There are so many things you can do with the hoop, I never knew!
I don't know if I will ever fuse it in a belly dance set, however my goal is to learn fire hooping. I think it's scary and amazing, so i have to do it. Other than that, it is mainly for exercise, for me.

In the video above, the girl in the middle is my hoop teacher (in San Diego). She's a great, fun teacher, and I just love her body type.

I am working on this as well. Safire's YouTube videos are really good but I started taking classes in my hometown and would definitely recommend it, you learn SO much faster! The only issue I have been having with it, is you lose so much of that cheek that I love in bellydance because you can't suddenly throw in an unexpected accent. That being said, I think its a prop that really lends itself to bellydance fusion. :)

The unexpected accents can come from the break/reverse/paddling technique...that's challenging and so much fun.

I would like to get into a class but I doubt there are any in my area. Are there any DVDs you reccommend?

Also its getting cold here in Columbus and I'm not sure about where I can practice. I for sure can't do it in my house. Too much stuff to break.

I love all your pictures especially Sonja's with the tray. Thats really brave. And Shimarella I totally want one of those awesome LED hoops. I love the bright colorfil candi kid outfit. adorable.

(excuse any of my bad writing and typos. I'm usually on here at like 3am)

I really recommend Hoopnotica's DVDs. I love Hoopgirl for other reasons but I just don't think they break down the moves as clearly.

Ya, I pretty much just take a break from it in the winter, but its frustrating not being able to practice. You could maybe check if there's a community in your area that get together and practice in a common space? I know there are frequent "hoop jams" in Vancouver during the summer, (although I haven't found any winter ones). But if you can get a group of people together, it makes renting a space a lot more affordable.

Speaking of which, any hoop/bellydancers in Vancouver wanting to join me???

I started hooping a few years ago and love it. I find that things from my dancing that apply are music interpretation, transitions, stillness, things like that. As far as actual physical movements I find it completely different than the belly part of belly dancing, so I've never been moved to combine the two (I'm the same way about poi too). I love having a non-BD movement to do, it gives my brain a break and I often go back to dancing ready to tackle something that's been giving me trouble.

Edit: I love this hooper's Youtube videos:
YouTube - Caroleeena's Channel

It makes me sad that no one has spoken up on this thread to point out that hooping fusion is very far removed from belly dancing. A stray hip lift or rib cage accent doesn't automatically confer bellydancitude on something a dancer is doing.

I think it's fine to enjoy hooping. A creative person can make a performance art out of it that's great fun to watch, and I agree that hooping is fun to do. I enjoy good performance art, and that includes good hooping. But I have yet to see a hooping act that looks even remotely like belly dancing to me, even if it does have a stray undulation thrown in somewhere.

Originally Posted by kazoogrrl

I started hooping a few years ago and love it. I find that things from my dancing that apply are music interpretation, transitions, stillness, things like that. As far as actual physical movements I find it completely different than the belly part of belly dancing, so I've never been moved to combine the two (I'm the same way about poi too). I love having a non-BD movement to do, it gives my brain a break and I often go back to dancing ready to tackle something that's been giving me trouble.

Edit: I love this hooper's Youtube videos:
YouTube - Caroleeena's Channel

Well done you!
I can't see why anyone should want to combine the two or see there is anything appropriate in such a fusion.
Hoop dancing is energetic and worthwhile, entertaining when done well .
What makes anyone think it should be combined with a dance that is based in the culture of the ME? Now if Dina should introduce the hoop as part of her routine, I can see everyone reaching for the prop but until then, I am confused....
And yes I use my knowledge of belly dance when I dance tribal style (note I now longer call that belly-dancing)and I use it now when I social dance because I have forgotten how to dance Western style..l;, but I can't work how we arrived at that one out but hooping and hoop dancing ..c::

Well... I was going to see how long it took for someone else to come in and do the "hooping and bellydance don't go together" spiel ;)

I thought I'd just provide useful information for hoopers who were looking for more resources in their learning curve. Maybe this thread should just move to off-topic?

In any case, Valentina's video that I posted is the closest to a belly-hoop fusion that I actually like. I did mention in my first post that I don't do any belly-hoop fusion myself and it is because I don't feel I've seen it done well enough that I'm inspired to do something similiar. Personally I just enjoy the opportunity to dance in other ways with the hoop and just use my BD vocabulary creatively when I rock out.

And opinions like the above two are what leave me second-guessing myself when I even consider the notion (because those are good and reasonable points)...so yeah. If I were to someday come up with an awesome bellydance-hoop routine you can be assured it will be far far away from the hallowed grounds of conventional BD venues :)

Besides which I'd hate to bean someone in the eye with a stray hoop. It would totes ruin the feeling of Inta Omri.

[QUOTE=shimarella;560603]
In any case, Valentina's video that I posted is the closest to a belly-hoop fusion that I actually like. I did mention in my first post that I don't do any belly-hoop fusion myself and it is because I don't feel I've seen it done well enough that I'm inspired to do something similiar. Personally I just enjoy the opportunity to dance in other ways with the hoop and just use my BD vocabulary creatively when I rock out.
[QUOTE]

I think this is an opportunity to be ahead of the curve. Be the first one to do an excellent fusion with it. Maybe I'll do it some day. As of right now I'm still not that great of a bellydancer and just a beginning hooper.

From what I've seen I think a hoop dance fusion would be hoop dance fused with bellydance rather than bellydancing with a hoop. Like you said, using the dance vocabulary in a different context.

I'm excited. Definitely adding hoopnotica's dvds to my Christmas wish list!

Originally Posted by shimarella

Personally I just enjoy the opportunity to dance in other ways with the hoop and just use my BD vocabulary creatively when I rock out.

In addition to belly dance, I also know how to do Scottish Highland dance, tap dance, and international folk dance. I've never felt the need to mix belly dancing with Swedish zwiefacher (a type of folk dance) or with the Highland fling.

As a dancer, I enjoy doing each dance style in its original form, and I don't think I'd derive any extra satisfaction out of mixing them. I'd rather think of myself as someone who can do each of several things well in a form that would be recognized by people who love that form, rather than do a mix of all of them simply for the sake of mixing.

I hear you but I also think that's simply an artistic choice. I don't believe in "never the twain shall meet" when it comes to my dance vocabulary if I can find some fun and creative connections. Now whether I should share that with the GP or fellow connoisseurs of one style or another is my call and pretty much based on my confidence in the proper context of the performance as well as the quality of the piece!

Also, while hoopdance has specific object manipulation vocabulary it is a dance style that really encourages the performer to bring their own flair to the dance. This is not a sacred ancient style specific to anyone culture, so it really does allow the participant to make it their own.

Kepi, I agree, I think a hoopdance that had elements of bellydance in it would be cool if done well. I'm having too much fun indulging my inner rave kid/hip-hop diva right now to seriously consider it though!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFA8_PbOOtA&feature=player_embedded]YouTube - ojai day 2009 - Deina Santoyo[/ame]


It's been done and despite my reservations, I have to say this is an entertaining piece of skilful dancing.

yes. that. more of it! <3 I love the dude's commentary at the end.

I admit that I enjoyed that video very much, Liza. That was hypnotizing, although I think that was due to the music.

That was very pretty and a great example of "being in the hoop" as they say.

I thought I'd take a crack at Lisa's query about why try combining the two forms, whatever the purpose of that combination may be. Maybe a hooper on this thread will find it useful.

•You already need some of the basic BD rib and hip isolations to make the hoop go.
•Personalising your hoopdance with the moves and music that you already have a knowledge of and care about
•As a prop, a hoop is a great framing and balancing device.
•When you figure out how to do a sustained spin/stall, the effect is as beautiful and hypnotic as when you spin endlessly with a veil or other prop.
•You might just invent some cool new moves and move the whole scene forward. The break/reverse/paddling methodology of accenting music with your hoop was largely pushed forward by a guy ( Baxter) who wanted to express his love of hip-hop music through hooping...until then it was pretty much all smooth hooping. An architect ( Rich/Isopop) is really pioneering some cool visual patterns with off-the-body moves. So why not see where bellydancing can take you?

Don't get me wrong, I have actually become quite unsympathetic towards the fusion attempts I've seen lately in the BD scene and I have nicely suggested to several hoopers that if they want to incorporate hip-hop or bellydance into their hooping that they should take a real class and enjoy the movement for what it is first. I have turned down opportunities to teach hooping to bellydancers that I know will attempt some bad fusion after two lessons and I have so far also turned down the invitation to perform bellydance/hoop routines at bellydance events because I'm not sure I need to be pegged as that weird dancer who will do anything but actually, ya know, bellydance. But I am slightly rankled by the notion that the best thing to do in all cases is to leave BD alone in its pureness unless an Egyptian dancer tries it first. ( I am of course, exaggerating to make my point, LOL)

I think that most of the hoopers on this thread were already engaging in a pretty nuanced conversation, BTW, about what was useful about bellydance training that could translated to hoopwork and whether or not combining the two to whatever degree would work or be a good idea. I didn't think a disclaimer about fusion was really necessary.

awesome vid, makes me wanna hoop!

Originally Posted by shimarella

You already need some of the basic BD rib and hip isolations to make the hoop go.

Really? I'm not so sure about this. Now, I don't hoop well enough to do it in front of other people, but what I notice when I do it is that I use my core muscles very, very differently from the way I use them in belly dance. I actually don't think there's much similarity in the movement aesthetic between spinning a hoop versus doing belly dance moves. Hooping energy, by its nature, needs to be sent outward from your body to maintain the hoop momentum. Belly dance energy, on the other hand, is more internal-focused, as if you're letting bits and pieces leak out a little at a time.

Is your experience different from this?

Originally Posted by shimarella

•Personalising your hoopdance with the moves and music that you already have a knowledge of and care about
•As a prop, a hoop is a great framing and balancing device.
•When you figure out how to do a sustained spin/stall, the effect is as beautiful and hypnotic as when you spin endlessly with a veil or other prop.

Now, I would agree that these are all good things to do with a hoop dance. As I said before, it's a performing art that I enjoy watching skilled people do. But these things can all be done without proclaiming your hoop performance to be a belly dance fusion.

Originally Posted by shimarella

•You might just invent some cool new moves and move the whole scene forward. The break/reverse/paddling methodology of accenting music with your hoop was largely pushed forward by a guy ( Baxter) who wanted to express his love of hip-hop music through hooping...until then it was pretty much all smooth hooping. An architect ( Rich/Isopop) is really pioneering some cool visual patterns with off-the-body moves. So why not see where bellydancing can take you?

Now, perhaps I should clarify something. I'm not opposed to hoopers incorporating the occasional undulation or hip drop into their hooping if they can make it fit well with the music and the overall flow. And studying a dance form, ANY dance form, will help bring a performer's awareness to the aesthetics of moving in time to music.

But then, I see belly dance as being more than a movement vocabulary. Just because you do a hip drop or an undulation doesn't make it belly dance, whether or not a hula hoop is involved.

So my thought is that sure, if learning a belly dance undulation helps you express what you want to express with the hoop, go ahead and use that undulation in the hooping. Just don't call the resulting performance "belly dance".
[/QUOTE]

Now, I would agree that these are all good things to do with a hoop dance. As I said before, it's a performing art that I enjoy watching skilled people do. But these things can all be done without proclaiming your hoop performance to be a belly dance fusion.

This is where I completely concur with Shira.
I love that performance I posted. Skilful and entertaining but despite the movements and the hip scarf..belly dance..mmm
Tonight on stage and tomorrow I'll be dancing with a troupe and although the tribal style moves we use are based in Egyptian belly dance to a certain extent, we have fused them with more avant-guarde costuming and German Medieval music so we are quite happy not to be called belly dancers..it's a step too far from the ME despite the Ghawazee style coats and turbans.
There comes a point when fusions are so far removed from belly dance- the dance of the ME . And put those movements togther with an albeit skilful use of a hoop and it's the same effect.

Shira:
Yes, you use your muscles somewhat differently but if you understand how to isolate your hips and ribs ( for circles), the waist and chest hooping basics will come a lot easier to you. It's not a clean translation ( depending on how beginner you are and how big the hoop is) but I found it very useful to start.

The inward/outward energy you mentioned is also quite true...if you only view your bellydancing is being internal driven, which isn't everyone's style, especially with a prop.

As for the rest, we'll have to agree to disagree on some things...I think its mainly semantics. It's not about making it "belly dance"; the conversation was (or became) about how to incorporate your BD skills into your hooping.

Back to the conversation of videos, I do really love Hoopnotica, too, I forgot I do have one of theirs, as well.

My 2 cents on the belly-hoop fusion thing...I wouldn't call it "bellydance" but I can tell you that everywhere I've danced it at festivals (especially festivals where children are present and can be encouraged to hoop as well), and even at the restaurant, it has been met with lots of enthusiasm.

Agree with Shimarella, it comes down to semantics. Call it whatever you want. I call it fun ;-)

Wow that was a great performance! I love that clip - Lizajuk thank you for posting it!!

Originally Posted by Sonja2

I do belly-hoop fusion! I have done it at the restaurant I worked at, which is Egyptian. The manager loved loved loved it. I also did it while balancing candle tray on my head.

Sometimes I'm afraid I'm approaching becoming a one-woman circus, but it's fun, and as long as people like it, well...I'm having fun.

Honestly, I'm self taught, too, but there are really great teachers out there. I did purchase a Gaia yoga-hoop dvd ages ago (about 8 years ago) that helped me learn. I don't do a whole lot of "tricks" per se...I do arms, neck, body spins, and so forth....when you combine all that with shimmies, shoulder shimmies, hip drops, and undulations--well, you don't need anything else!!!

I attached a photo for you of me doing hoop with candle tray--oh, I do floorwork with the hoop, spinning hoop on knees & sitting back on feet while turning in a circle on my knees. (not the most flattering picture of me...but you get the drift)

Wow, that is amazing!!! And wonderful photo!