Thread: If you aren't good at something, do you still try?

My question is " Do you feel that you are really only good at one style of middle eastern dance, but try to dance the other styles anyway?"

For example, I feel like I can perform Beledi or Saidi pretty well, but as much as I like to do it, I feel like I am not good at classical oriental styling. I try to perform oriental style sometimes, but always wind up disappointed with my performances. Maybe part of this is that I find earthy music more fun and playful, although I love to listen to classical Egyptian songs.

Do you stick to the style that you are naturally better at, or do you keep trying to master the others?

there's a quote from Martha Ghram, that goes "dance is the hidden language of the soul" and i like to say that some people's soul speaks ballet, some people's speaks samba, mine speaks BD.
so i think it's important to dance a style that you ENJOY dancing and that you feel you can express yourself with. but also to try others.

That's a good question, because I'm having the same internal debate.

When it comes to Lebanese, Turkish and American Cabaret styles, I know exactly what to do. The movement style and musical interpretations feel 100% intuitive to my brain and my body. As a petite person, I like to fill my space, haul ass across the dance floor, and be flashy, charismatic and larger than life.

I've been struggling with Egyptian style, OTOH, for about 3 years. Beledi and folkloric come much easier because it's earthy and funky. Traditional Egyptian raqs sharqi feels very stilted and unnatural on me, even though it looks so relaxed and gorgeous on other dancers. When I attempt to dance "subtle," I have to actively fight my urges to be fierce and flashy and make my movements big.

I always feel like I've admired Egyptian style from afar, but could never get really cozy with it on a personal level. That being said, I still attend Egyptian workshops because I can always get something out of them, even if it's a different perspective. My Egyptian training has also helped me to pull in the reins when I do Lebanese or Turkish style so it's a bit more controlled and elegant.

However, I no longer feel like I have to beat myself up for not being Egyptian enough. If I excel in the more extroverted styles, why should I take my strengths for granted?

Originally Posted by SatinWorship19

However, I no longer feel like I have to beat myself up for not being Egyptian enough. If I excel in the more extroverted styles, why should I take my strengths for granted?

That's exactly what I mean. I think everyone has a certain style that they are naturally better at. I have started thinking that it would be much better if we, as dancers, embraced our natural talents. I feel like too often, I try to dance to songs that just don't fit my personality or natural movements, when what I really want to do is something earthy and grounded.

I hope some other Bhuzzers will share their opinions about it.

I'm definitely a beledi chick. But sometimes I feel pigeon holed - so recently I gritted my teeth for some (classical) Orientale. Sorry - I just couldn't help it - I have to take the piss even as I danced it. So the result wasn't quite the challenge I had set myself.

I'm somewhere in between on this one. I do my best to try everything at least once, and some of them are definitely not for me (tribal style) but at least I tried them. I think you have to know your limits and interests, but push yourself within those interests. There is no shame in finding your limitations, but stagnation within those limits is a shame. Try a different style of folkloric dance you've never done before.

Originally Posted by mrsnj20

That's exactly what I mean. I think everyone has a certain style that they are naturally better at. I have started thinking that it would be much better if we, as dancers, embraced our natural talents. I feel like too often, I try to dance to songs that just don't fit my personality or natural movements, when what I really want to do is something earthy and grounded.

I hope some other Bhuzzers will share their opinions about it.

I know exactly what you are talking about. I also think that it's an excellent idea to study what you're not good at because it adds dimension and range to what you ARE good at. For some reason your strengths and your control over them grows too. Reinforcing what you already know while continually challenging yourself is what makes a dancer grow.

Originally Posted by mrsnj20

...Do you stick to the style that you are naturally better at, or do you keep trying to master the others?

I think if we never pushed passed what we're good at no one would ever keep at zills/sagat long enough to play them...then again in some areas from what I hear they're dying out to a certain degree.
I think part of the outlook on this question depends upon what your goals are with the dance.
If you want to work- you have to be able to do a full show and depict variety in your 20 or so minutes.
Think about it- Fifi Abdo- beledi girl through and through. She still did oriental, Oum Kolthoum etc. She was of course Fifi Fabulous all the time- but beledi and down and earthy was where she shone. Every dancer has their strengths.
I've been flitting around with pieces of fabric since I was a little girl, so veil comes naturally to me and "fits." Saidi felt really awkward at first, but I worked through it and have grown to love it and really have fun with it. Egyptian style was really, really hard for me at first, but I struggled through.
Sometimes finding the right teacher can help us break through and sometimes just hours and hours for months and months (and years) - sheer exposure - can help us get there. We might not get "great" at it, but it will help us grow. Through comparison/contrasting help us learn more about the different parts/styles of the dance AND likely teach us more about the culture.
We're ALWAYS going to have some things we're better at and some things that resonate more within us- but that doesn't mean we should give up on the rest. Pick our favorites for when we want to "shine" (paid events, big events), but grow with (some) others to help us grow (haflas etc). That's my theory.

I always keep trying things I am not good at. I even keep trying things I don't like, such as sauer kraut. ..g.:

I love my veils and zills but I am always looking for something new and challenging (when I am in the mood, that is). Because I used to be a fighter, however, dancing wasn't something I was instantly good at. Now that I realize there isn't much difference between the two - or rather I see the similarities now rather than the differences - I am definitely a 'bellydancer of the soul' all the way.

But if I hadn't kept trying all those years ago, I wouldn't be a dancer now. So I try to keep at it even if it seems impossible. Doing impossible things is something I enjoy very much.

It is helpful to your development to push yourself to do things you do not have a strong natural affinity for, but what is beneficial as a student doesn't always make for quality entertainment. Whenever possible, I wouldn't recommend doing something you're not good at or comfortable with for a paying audience. Let them see the things you really excel at and save the experiments and not-quite-there-yets for home practice and goofing around at informal haflas.

Lots of us in the same boat---looking for a new way to paddle(sorry---very small joke). I started w/ Tonya and Atlantis dancing to John Bilezikjian, Var Dagdavarian, even Raja(which will tell some of you that i have been dancing for a while!!!!). I knew nothing, i asked a audience member one night "What is the song about?" he said " i have no idea, i speak Arabic and he is singing in Armenian". So from there, i started slowly to figure things out. I went to Rakkasah years ago and saw----no Turkish style teaching, lots of Egyptian style, so i started to learn bits from Jamilla al Wahid, Momo, Leila Haddad, Zahra Zuhair and others, i couldn't do a piston hip if you paid me. The Egyptian music at the festival bugged me. Years pass, my musical and dance appreciation widened, class w/ Angelika and Sahra helped. Then 7 years ago i got a job at Babouch, Moroccan restaurant run by Coptic Egyptians, I had to listen to some of the cds i had purchased and never used. By this time, (Mendicino dance and music camp helped lots, and drum class w/ Souhail Kaspar), I had some of the Egyptian absorbed---so i worked on my dancing w/ Egyptian music, i had some great friends who helped w/ my questions.

so---now w/ my long answer---when i do Turkish and zills--people say ---that was so great---but i am taking classes and workshops to learn the Egyptian stuff, I have a great dance partner who trained w/ Angelika, so i am performing more at festivals to Egyptian music to push myself. My friends say i am getting better and i like my performance videos a little better.

I love the classical songs, I love the style, but my body struggles with it. I just keep hammering away.

Yes & no. I don't play zills. I'm not comfortable enough with them that I would bust them out in a public gig, even if I can hang in there in a zils class/workshop. Customers will just have to live with my other skills & my considerable charm LOL

As far as other styles of BD dance, I figure even if I don't master them completely or like them enough to adopt them wholesale there's at least a move or a 'tude that's worth learning so I can interpret it in my own way.

Sometimes I set myself a challenge ( like..dance like a bellydance princess to "real" beledi music instead of hip-hop bulgarian bollywood at a BD showcase) and sometimes my style changes and I appreciate the things I didn't get before.

So I don't close doors...just leave them ajar ;)

If my heart is into learning it, I go for it, even if it isn't something I'm particularly good at. It's a different feeling for me than things I simply enjoy watching others. At least with me, in life in general, the things that I tend to excel at are the things that interest me the most, not necessarily what I'm naturally good at.

It depends on what it is.

I am not good at heavy pop'n'lock, urban fusion styles. They also do not interest me (in terms of them being something I want to learn), therefore, I am not going to spend my money on a class in this style.

I am not naturally good at zills either, however, I DO keep trying those, and will put money into lessons. This skill directly impacts how I see myself as a dancer, and its something I feel I NEED to learn to become a good dancer. So yes, I will keep plugging away at zills, or anything else that I dont initially 'get' but feel I need to learn.

...Oh, this reminds me of something I said to my Pilates students yesterday. A couple were struggling with a move and I said "You're here for a reason. It's OK to be working on something and it's OK to struggle. If you already knew it all, why bother coming to class?"
It's not always a comfortable position for some people- to be corrected, or to not be good at something. But in truth, we ALL start somewhere. If it's something we want- keep on trying.

It was great to hear all of the different views about this. I too try to take extra classes and training in the areas I'm not so good at and I agree that it's okay to perform things that you are working on at haflas. I'm glad to see that other people feel the same way. I guess that if we were all good at every style then there wouldn't be any classes as Samira said...
I think it gives us a goal to work toward.

Before I saw this thread, I was thinking about posting the same question! :)

I have seen videos of myself doing different styles, and it confirms that not only do I FEEL better with earthy, grounded stuff, I quite obviously DANCE better, too.

I don't know, it's like wearing a certain style of dress. Certain styles just "hang" better on your body than others.

That said, I do like to try other styles- I took a tribal workshop and was in over my head, believe me- but my heart always returns to the heavy, folky, Egyptian stuff.

You're exactly right - the performing venue is the difference. Why not try something new at a hafla - everyone should be OK with not being "perfect" all the time ..l;,
I wonder how many teachers are willing to try something new in front of their students? I think that can make a big impression, don't you? If the student sees their teacher trying something they're not "perfect" at, the student should feel better about getting out there & doing what they can, at the level they're at (in the right venue, of course!).

Originally Posted by mrsnj20

It was great to hear all of the different views about this. I too try to take extra classes and training in the areas I'm not so good at and I agree that it's okay to perform things that you are working on at haflas. I'm glad to see that other people feel the same way. I guess that if we were all good at every style then there wouldn't be any classes as Samira said...
I think it gives us a goal to work toward.

Oh, yes, I continue to try. I continue to chip away at classic Egyptian Orientale, although I don't know that I'm always so great at it. I don't feel as graceful as I feel the style requires. But I do my damndest. Conversely, sha'abi and baladi come easily to me. They feel more like what I'm used to.

It is my secret dream (well, it's not a secret now) to dance to Om Kolthoum and really do her songs justice. I am in love with her music and have been since I begun my fascination with Middle Eastern Dance. I dance away to her in the privacy of my basement or bedroom, but haven't had the courage to put it onstage yet. Soon, though, I think.

Originally Posted by anthea

I wonder how many teachers are willing to try something new in front of their students? I think that can make a big impression, don't you? If the student sees their teacher trying something they're not "perfect" at, the student should feel better about getting out there & doing what they can, at the level they're at (in the right venue, of course!).

I think there is a fine line between showing you still have areas where you can and want to learn (going to workshops with your students) and demonstrating poor judgment about your limitations (teaching or performing something you haven't mastered for money). Circumstances are a big part of this. A teacher who wants to discuss a new technique she's still working on with a small group of advanced students is in a different position than a teacher who can't play finger cymbals very well and is trying to teach beginners to play, or who just got a new prop she hasn't learned to manipulate gracefully but uses it for her solo as part of her group's stage time at the community festival. Part of a teacher's job is helping students understand the difference between what is suitable to present and what isn't as a function of venue.

I keep trying.

Some things I know I'll never do, like ATS, but what's the harm in watching/learning? In fact it's important I think to try and stretch as an artist, even if you're uncomfortable physically, musically and/or philosophically.

I wouldn't teach/perform an iffy style though, maybe experiment in front of the mirror and/or trusted friends (like my cats!)..l;,

If we only ever worked on what we already knew or were naturally good at, few of us would ever get better at anything or learn anything new.
However, there might come a time for some dancers when they might want to or need to specialize in a style or an aspect of the dance, meaning they then have to devote more resources to one area of study and focus less on the others.

Originally Posted by yameyameyame

If we only ever worked on what we already knew or were naturally good at, few of us would ever get better at anything or learn anything new.
However, there might come a time for some dancers when they might want to or need to specialize in a style or an aspect of the dance, meaning they then have to devote more resources to one area of study and focus less on the others.

In general, I always tell people that they weren't born knowing how to walk. They fell many, many times before they took their first steps by themselves and even those probably weren't amazing.