Thread: History of demi-pointe

A discussion elsewhere has led me to ponder this question.

What is the history of dance on demi-pointe? I am asking it as a general question about dance in general, but also as a belly dance specific question about the history of demi-pointe in belly dance.

Was demi-pointe invented in ballet before or around the time pointe work began, or did it already exist in other dances?

Why do we do so much of our traveling in belly dance on demi-pointe? Was demi-pointe used in any folkloric dances in the Middle East without the influence of ballet? Or did demi-pointe creep into belly dance around the time the Egyptians began to revise it and adapt it for the stage?

When Ballet first started as a court dance, the dancers wore conventional court shoes with high heels. It was when ballet really transitioned from a court dance to the theater that things changed. People wanted to see dancers "float," in early theaters, dancers would leap, be on their toes and/or be rigged with ropes to look like they were flying and floating. I believe Pointe work really got underway in the mid-19th Century, when dancers wanted to create that float without using ropes and wires. There were a few dancers who started performing in early point shoes (I believe) essentially as a gimmick. But it was so popular, it became standard for women to dance in Pointe shoes. So I would guess demi Pointe evolved slightly before or in connection with Pointe.

I think in general, traveling on the toes allows for smaller quicker steps. You can move very quickly and smoothly on your toes, creating that floaty, light appearance. Can also make turning easier.

Don't know exactly when it came into bellydance and how easy that would be to trace. I have heard some folk dancers from North Africa/Mid East dance on extensively on their toes (Tunisian? Persian?)

I don't have any hard facts, but some impressions:

Demi-pointe makes the foot look beautiful. If you have ever watched a dancer who is very flat-footed, you will notice that something is missing. I was always taught as a baby dancer to watch the feet of a dancer I wanted to emulate. Having pretty, graceful-looking feet is important in dance.

I have the feeling that dancing on the balls of the feet, or alternating flat and ball in the steps, came across the Silk Road and goes back very far in the history of the dance. But I can't prove it.

Originally Posted by dunyah

I don't have any hard facts, but some impressions:

Demi-pointe makes the foot look beautiful. If you have ever watched a dancer who is very flat-footed, you will notice that something is missing. I was always taught as a baby dancer to watch the feet of a dancer I wanted to emulate. Having pretty, graceful-looking feet is important in dance.

I have the feeling that dancing on the balls of the feet, or alternating flat and ball in the steps, came across the Silk Road and goes back very far in the history of the dance. But I can't prove it.

wow ! now i am re playing every geographic show i ever saw..you are right...i think the flat is a lead off foot /dum thing in many villiage dances going as far back as i can remember...and dipping the torso or sholder with the "flat". the horsey steps used in cane use the demi point. but if you dump the ballet term and call it "ball" of the foot, it fits more dances ...i am most likely nuts and this is another OCD thing in my head..but this thread got me thinking of the terms used for many forms of dance do not match , but are the same step .

Totally theorizing here... but it seems to me that in folk dances of the world which I have seen (not that many, and more European than anything else), you see people rise on to their toes more often when their traveling step has a "springing" or "skipping" motion. (For example, Scottish Country dance, Irish step dance, mazurka.) So if there are any ME folk dances that have this "quality", perhaps travel on demi-pointe is older than we think?

To add another element, it's not abnormal to rise up on the toes. And it feels nice when you do it. And it allows you to bob up and down and, as people have said, move with lightness. While I tend to be sceptical of the "early dance involved copying birds and animals" theory, I can't imagine people *didn't* sometimes imitate animals and there are plenty of animals that either do, or appear to, walk on their toes.

I walked around on my toes before I ever had a ballet lesson or saw a ballet dancer. Quite a lot of kids will run on their toes. So it's not outside the usual realm of human experience or activity.

Don't know exactly when it came into bellydance and how easy that would be to trace. I have heard some folk dancers from North Africa/Mid East dance on extensively on their toes (Tunisian? Persian?)

Tunisian dance is very much on the balls of the feet. I don't now a lot about Persian dance but the flat-ball step is definitely used in it. And in the gulf of course.

Demi-pointe makes the foot look beautiful. If you have ever watched a dancer who is very flat-footed, you will notice that something is missing. I was always taught as a baby dancer to watch the feet of a dancer I wanted to emulate. Having pretty, graceful-looking feet is important in dance.

True, but beautiful is a culturally-inscribed notion, not universal, and I think we have to be careful about making that assumption. Desmond Morris and his ilk would probably link it to feet arching in orgasm *eyeroll* which is equally dodgy, really. In fact I think I read that somewhere once.

*I* like an arched foot but then I grew up with ballet and high heels *and* naturally very high arches of my own. When I look at many of the modern Egyptian stars they have objectively nice feet but they're quite flat. They don't tend to come up really high on the ball a lot - there's a lot of that in-between position, what I call semi-demi. And I've seen dancers in central Asian styles whose feet fascinate me, but they're not dainty up-high feet, they're rolling through, grounded feet.

I have no cultural or historic proof or insight- I only know that *I* started using demi pointe when I decided to dance in heels. My instructor never even brought it up as an option, except for one step she taught us for a Turkish 9/8 we were working on. Once I got the feel for it & discovered that it added new dimension & options for changing heights/layers, I used it a lot.

Originally Posted by Zumarrad

True, but beautiful is a culturally-inscribed notion, not universal, and I think we have to be careful about making that assumption.

Yup... I was about to respond to that quote, but noticed you already said what I was going to say.

I agree also with the fact that traveling on the balls of the feet is generally faster... less clunky, etc. But, at least to me, it never felt intuitive, and I certainly don't think most people naturally have high enough of an arch and strong enough ankles to really be able to stand up high on the balls on their feet (as opposed to just having the heels just slightly off the ground).

Do you guys have videos of Tunisian dances that are done on the balls of the feet? And of any other folkloric ME dance, for that matter, that is done on the balls of the feet (the flat-ball step from Khaliji doesn't count).

Dancing on the balls of the feet is MUCH much older than ballet!

Here's an ancient Greek vase painting of dancers:

Encyclopedia - Britannica Online Encyclopedia

Note also the pointed toe on the lifted foot -

Not the most fab Tunisian I've seen but it appears to be done by Actual Tunisian People:



I was always taught that twisting step on demi that they do as a "Tunisian twist step". I've seen footage of the Tunisian Folkloric Ballet or similar organisation, and they danced very vigorously on demi and flat.

However, these ladies seem to dance flat footed:


I don't know where this lady is actually from but the style is definitely Tunisian and you can see she rises onto her balls:

we talked about this in classes. the armenian solo dance has always used the "step togther step" ..the step ball change was brought up..persian dance uses the ball of the foot as well..
tap has shuffel ball change...

Originally Posted by dunyah

I don't have any hard facts, but some impressions:

Demi-pointe makes the foot look beautiful. If you have ever watched a dancer who is very flat-footed, you will notice that something is missing. I was always taught as a baby dancer to watch the feet of a dancer I wanted to emulate. Having pretty, graceful-looking feet is important in dance.

I have the feeling that dancing on the balls of the feet, or alternating flat and ball in the steps, came across the Silk Road and goes back very far in the history of the dance. But I can't prove it.

I didn't meant to imply that demi-point or dancing on the balls of the feet is considered to be beautiful in every culture throughout history. Let me amend it to say that in my dance training I was taught to dance that way, and it looks much prettier TO ME than completely flat-footed dancing.

However, I would point out that dancing that way makes the foot appear smaller and more dainty, which is generally approved of for a woman's foot in lots of cultures, I should think.

I like Zum's term "semi-demi" because I think it's how more dancers rise onto the balls of their feet, as opposed to that high, true "demi" position.

I just think it's natural for human beings to do some stuff flat-footed and some stuff with the heels off the floor at various heights. Therefore, I'm not sure that ME dance in particular, especially the more folky stuff, would be influenced by specific foot positions created for a specific dance that came about on another continent.

*shrug*

I do both heels down and heels up as the situation calls for it: for example, sometimes I shimmy-walk flat-footed and sometimes I shimmy-walk with the heels up; the height of the heel in general probably mostly depends upon . . . uh . . . what I decide to do at the moment based on the music I'm hearing!

Deborah

Just to mention that one sees the "semi-demi" in a lot of sub-Saharan African dance...

I've done Yemeni folk dance and there are a lot of quick transitions that are done on the ball of the foot. As mentioned above, the less surface area of the foot that's on the floor, the less "drag," so you can move faster.

I agree with Elibelinde -- you see a lot of ancient art showing musicians and dancers, and they are often portrayed on the ball of the foot (although this COULD be just a visual "shorthand" for a traveling step, it seems more likely, since it spans different cultures, that it's actually a display of the dancer on "semi-demi."

However, I would point out that dancing that way makes the foot appear smaller and more dainty, which is generally approved of for a woman's foot in lots of cultures, I should think.

Yes, although even that's changed over the years! This mediaeval Adam and Eve (1537 I think) has often been pointed out to me as an example of how even in Europe ideas of female beauty have changed:

Eve has good-sized feet and big ears.

I find the feet of both really interesting in this picture actually - those are feet that have never worn any kind of binding footwear. Look at those splayed toes!

Originally Posted by Zumarrad

Yes, although even that's changed over the years! This mediaeval Adam and Eve (1537 I think) has often been pointed out to me as an example of how even in Europe ideas of female beauty have changed:

Eve has good-sized feet and big ears.

I find the feet of both really interesting in this picture actually - those are feet that have never worn any kind of binding footwear. Look at those splayed toes!

Those feet have never known tight footwear, for sure! What I find really funny though is the fruit hanging from the branch that is covering Adam's private parts. Tee hee.