Thread: Restaurant Issue

I have danced in a local restaurant, and it recently changed ownership. The new owner is really nice, however he's a middle eastern man who will not commit to having an exact time slot for the dancers. You may turn up at 8.30pm, hang around until 9.30pm (often he has a non middle eastern band there who were not expecting a dancer, and they tend to do 45 minute sets) - so at 9.30 you will do one set, and then have to hang around until 10.30 to do another set before eating or going home. If eating he's really hospitable, and offers food/drink and looks disappointed if you leave at say midnight. For this he pays $60. Under the new regime I find I'm not motivated to dance there, but I have gone as a customer (I like the food!), and he's asked me to come back & dance. I used the excuse that my boyfriend doesn't mind me dancing, but is not keen on having me out all evening, and I asked if there could be a slot. His response was "if *you* can sort something out [i.e. with my boyfriend] then perhaps you can come and dance?" This is currently the only gig in town. What would bhuz do?

i don't know what the rate is in your area...


but re: hanging out all night, i would give professional reasons why you can't stay (you have to train/do private gig/etc) because personal reasons can be argued with. your time is $$... time you spend waiting around is time you could be practicing, gigging, looking for gigs, etc. i think if there's not a way to 1) give you set time or 2) pay you enough that it justifies being there for so long (& i don't mean x number of dollars per set times 2 sets, i mean essentially paying you to wait), you should let this opportunity pass. i don't know what that's like, in those areas where there aren't that many opportunities, so this may seem easy to say... but there are worse things than not gigging. getting treated like crap at a gig is one of those things.

I'd stick to a time schedule.

He wants you to hang around waiting to dance for 2 + hours for $60?!!!!

What does he expect you to do when your not dancing?

Like any Professional entertainer would hang around for an hour without getting paid, Jeez! Well, I guess you have to decide if your time hanging around is more valuable to you or the restaurant owner. You could just tell him flat out what your price is for a 45 min. show plus waiting is and then leave it to that.

I am interested to know what other responses come up in this thread.

Originally Posted by Asteria

I(often he has a non middle eastern band there who were not expecting a dancer, and they tend to do 45 minute sets) - so at 9.30 you will do one set, and then have to hang around until 10.30 to do another set before eating or going home.

Surely he knows at least 24 hours in advance when he's likely to have a band. So why not arrange for you to show up at 9:30 pm on the evenings when there's a band? Why waste your time having you come in at 8:30 when there's no intention of having you dance before the band goes on break?

maybe he would be more inclined to stick with a time if you boyfriend came with you and looked disapprovingly when it got late?

or you have another gig at a specific time in a place that is far away to get to. therefore you have a certain time to dance and won't be able to get back

How about The Truth in some format that communicates the problem clearly? So that if everyone said the same thing, he'd know exactly what he needs to fix.

"I'd love to dance here, but the way the evenings are set up, I wind up spending 3 hours here to perform 2 sets. I'm sure you can see where that -- plus time preparing myself, rehearsing and burning my CD -- just isn't worth it to me for $60. If you ever get the schedule settled, be sure to call me, I used to LOVE dancing here!"

Originally Posted by Lauren_

I used to LOVE dancing here!"

Ha-ha, sounds like a guilt trip. I say be firm in your pricing - he asked her to dance there so he's interested. He just wants her on his terms, which suck.

Draw up a contract so if you both agree on terms and if he backs out one day, you can show him the copy of the contract and use that as canon fodder - so to speak.

I never really worked for a M.E. restaurant owner so I don't know how their mentality works - except for what I read, but you are the Entertainer who has her own self worth, right?

I agree with Lauren. Good, clear, honest communication usually works and earns you respect. Funny how hard it is to do - I think we were all too well taught as little girls to be people pleasers and say what other people want to hear.

Originally Posted by Surida

I agree with Lauren. Good, clear, honest communication usually works and earns you respect. Funny how hard it is to do - I think we were all too well taught as little girls to be people pleasers and say what other people want to hear.

Yes, well-worded Truth is always the best way to go! You can still be "nice" and firm at the same time.

If band, you come at 9:30; no band, you come at 8:30. No more than an hour between sets, so if you dance at 8:30, you dance again at 9:30, etc. If he wants you to have a longer timespan between sets, then he needs to pay you for waiting around.

I really can't speak to the pay issue, as I don't know what is normal for your area, but if you're doing two sets please be sure that you're getting paid for two sets plus any wait time between sets of more than an hour.


As to girls being raised to be people pleasers, I can agree with that. One thing I tried to do with my girls was to teach them to say what needs to be said, but to say it respectfully and politely; one can be nice, pleasant or whatever, but we've gotta be ready to tell people what they need to hear, not just what they want to hear -- although as their mother, I'd really rather hear what I want to hear . . .

Deborah

Originally Posted by Asteria

I have danced in a local restaurant, and it recently changed ownership. The new owner is really nice, however he's a middle eastern man who will not commit to having an exact time slot for the dancers. You may turn up at 8.30pm, hang around until 9.30pm (often he has a non middle eastern band there who were not expecting a dancer, and they tend to do 45 minute sets) - so at 9.30 you will do one set, and then have to hang around until 10.30 to do another set before eating or going home. If eating he's really hospitable, and offers food/drink and looks disappointed if you leave at say midnight. For this he pays $60. Under the new regime I find I'm not motivated to dance there, but I have gone as a customer (I like the food!), and he's asked me to come back & dance. I used the excuse that my boyfriend doesn't mind me dancing, but is not keen on having me out all evening, and I asked if there could be a slot. His response was "if *you* can sort something out [i.e. with my boyfriend] then perhaps you can come and dance?" This is currently the only gig in town. What would bhuz do?

Don't use your boyfriend as an excuse! That makes the owner think that YOU are ok with how he runs things, and he'll hope for a break-up so he can get his cheap, all night, dancer. Tell him straight up "I enjoyed dancing here, but if I don't know what time I will start, and what time I will leave, I simply can't do it. I need a start and finish time. If you make and stick to a regular schedule I will come back! "

Call ahead of time and make sure the time is good. Tell him you will wait for no more than 15 minutes. After 15 minutes, leave.

Suggest to the other dancers they do the same.

Originally Posted by Asteria

I used the excuse that my boyfriend doesn't mind me dancing, but is not keen on having me out all evening, and I asked if there could be a slot. His response was "if *you* can sort something out [i.e. with my boyfriend] then perhaps you can come and dance?" This is currently the only gig in town.

Don't use the boyfriend as the excuse.

Instead, say, "I'm sorry, but I can come work for you only if I can have a predictable start and end time, without too much down time in between the two sets. I'm a busy working dancer, and I do a lot of private parties. I need to be able to make commitments to the people hiring me for those regarding what time I dance for them. I just can't afford the waiting around that you're requesting, unless you're willing to pay me the $250 for the entire evening that I could otherwise make doing the private party."

This is businesslike, puts a value on your time, and paints a picture of you as being a sought-after talent.

The other reason NOT to use your boyfriend as an excuse...

Why would you tell a pushy man that your availability is based on the caprices of another man (regardless of if he's your boyfriend)? That just makes you look like you're easily swayed by keeping men happy and gives him more reason to be pushy.

If you must use your boyfriend as an excuse, make it about you.

"Time with my boyfriend is valuable to me, if you can't pay me for the extra time I'm stilling around and not out doing what I want, be it valuable time with him, or private parties that bring in cash...anything, I can't do it!"

I once danced 30 minutes for $40.00 and decided never to go back again. I think 2 hours + for what he's paying is not enough. But you say that's the only gig in town? Could you maybe take out an ad or get some business cards, if you don't have any, get them on bulletin boards, etc. and advertise to do weddings, anniversaries, parties, retirement, nursing homes, etc.? You could set your own rates and start your own business. Just an idea.

Is it even worth it to leave the house for $60? That seems really cheap to me and definitely not for more than an hour of being out.

Originally Posted by *Shira*

Instead, say, "I'm sorry, but I can come work for you only if I can have a predictable start and end time, without too much down time in between the two sets. I'm a busy working dancer, and I do a lot of private parties. I need to be able to make commitments to the people hiring me for those regarding what time I dance for them. I just can't afford the waiting around that you're requesting, unless you're willing to pay me the $250 for the entire evening that I could otherwise make doing the private party."

This is businesslike, puts a value on your time, and paints a picture of you as being a sought-after talent.

EXCELLENT!!!

Deborah

I've had several instances where I danced, entertained the crowd, only to have the person who hired me try to give me less than was agreed upon - notice the word "try." People who want something for nothing, why, a few times I've heard,"we thought there were two of you coming, so does that mean we only pay half?" To which I once replied, "There's only one of me, I entertained the crowd, they all looked happy, I danced my butt off, I deserve double half." Lol, nuts eh? You meet all kinds. I tell ya, some people just don't deserve to be entertained! But for every jackass, who tried to rip you, there's a few gems out there.

I think there's some kind of warped philosophy to the "jackass" dilemma....I'm a small person in stature, I have fine features, I'm rather soft spoken at times, and I think that "some" of these people who hire me think I'm a pushover, that I'll take whatever they offer and say, "thank-you." Aren't they surprised, when I look them straight in the eye and say, "that wasn't the agreement." Last time that happened, the lady towered over me; she literally shrank inch by inch down to my size as she forked over the granola. "Why, thank-you! It's been a pleasure entertaining here!" I said. As a further observation, isn't it interesting and also a bit disheartening to note that she had the entire $150.00 cash in that envelope....and not half? It's like she almost expected....the unexpected.

Like I said, you meet all kinds, everywhere you go. Nothing new. Nothing old. You gotta' be ready for anything out there. But do NOT, I repeat do NOT, let anyone take advantage of you nor try to give you less than you deserve! At the end of the day, you have to be able to look in the mirror and like what you see. There's nothing worse than fuming and fermenting inside over not having stood up for yourself and simply said, "No."

Originally Posted by Crystallia

I've had several instances where I did the dancing, entertained the crowd, only to have the person who hired me come to me afterward and try to give me less than was agreed upon. People who want something for nothing, people who try to rip you off, to me, don't deserve to be entertained.

Although I've been dancing for many years, I can recall only one instance of something like this. I can't even remember the incident exactly . . . it's almost more of an impression than a memory. Hmmm . . .

Deborah

just as an addition. I did not mean in my posts that the truth is not the best option. I wish it was always the easiest. There have been times where even after stating the truth/problem over and over again I was still not heard by the owner and had to resort to excuses to get my way and to stop the badgering. sad but true.

I've been having this same issue with a new restaurant - and I want out bad!
They recently asked me to come in for a big party and I agreed having already agreed on a set price. I got there and not a person in sight... 'oh, yeah, sorry. they cancelled and we forgot to tell you, can you still go out and dance just for tips?'
Nope, sorry, not dancing for two tables.
The night before this I had three gigs in a row and I was literally running to my car to get to the next gig on time. Here's what the manager said before I left - 'listen, i'm trying to be flexible with you here but you're not really cooperating with me. i asked you to do a half an hour set and now you're leaving? i'm trying to run a business here.'
Sorry, I have other gigs and I'm not dancing anymore than 30 minutes.

I want out of this so bad but they just put me on for Saturday nights and I hate confrontation - I just know this guy is going to make me feel like crap for leaving so soon.
oh yeah, and they still owe me and most of the staff money. can we say sketchy?

One of the places I dance at is really struggling. I am supposed to have 2 shows approx an hour apart but lately I have to hang around and hang around until he decides if there is enough business for the second show to go on. I am going to suggest to him that they just cancel the second show completely and stop advertising it until business picks up. I think it is crappy for the 2 tables who came expecting to see me to have the show suddenly cancelled because he feels there isn't enough business to justify paying me. At all restaurant gigs in my area there is waiting between shows,though most are pretty good about sticking to set times. Perhaps you could explain to him that by not having set times the public will be confused as to when to come out and see the show. He may be losing business because of that.

Originally Posted by ElissaDancer

I've been having this same issue with a new restaurant - and I want out bad!
They recently asked me to come in for a big party and I agreed having already agreed on a set price. I got there and not a person in sight... 'oh, yeah, sorry. they cancelled and we forgot to tell you, can you still go out and dance just for tips?'
Nope, sorry, not dancing for two tables.
The night before this I had three gigs in a row and I was literally running to my car to get to the next gig on time. Here's what the manager said before I left - 'listen, i'm trying to be flexible with you here but you're not really cooperating with me. i asked you to do a half an hour set and now you're leaving? i'm trying to run a business here.'
Sorry, I have other gigs and I'm not dancing anymore than 30 minutes.

I want out of this so bad but they just put me on for Saturday nights and I hate confrontation - I just know this guy is going to make me feel like crap for leaving so soon.
oh yeah, and they still owe me and most of the staff money. can we say sketchy?

It sounds like you're dealing with a shady place, and you should quit. If he's trying to guilt trip you for doing your job (why on earth would you dance longer than 30 min ift that's the agreement?) and then isn't really paying you, I wouldn't dance there.

Another dancer had actually recommended the place to me because she had danced there before. Now, I'm pretty sure there was different management when she was there. I've really only danced there about two or three times. But the worst part is that just yesterday (after posting ironically) the bartender told me they booted the other dancer so I could start dancing on Saturdays instead of her. That just makes me feel lousy. But she can have them back now!

Originally Posted by ElissaDancer

Another dancer had actually recommended the place to me because she had danced there before. Now, I'm pretty sure there was different management when she was there. I've really only danced there about two or three times. But the worst part is that just yesterday (after posting ironically) the bartender told me they booted the other dancer so I could start dancing on Saturdays instead of her. That just makes me feel lousy. But she can have them back now!

You know, sometimes the best thing is safety in numbers. If several of you who dance there can forge a united front for this (even if you normally don't even like each other), you can get a lot done! When he realizes that you're willing to all throw in the towel and walk out, then he'll start treating you better. Sort of "unionized", but hey, dancers really do need to stick together. Just a suggestion... This doesn't mean you should use safety in numbers to abuse managers, though, (i.e. over charging, etc..) just that you ask for fair treatment.