Thread: Was my pricing 'way out of line???

I received a "gig-alert" from Gigmasters.com, with which I am a subscribing entertainer, and recently bid on the following scenario:

2 1/2 hour "arabian nights"-themed lunch-time gig for "doctors' day" with two dancers. The gig consisted of greeting the docs as they arrived and posing for pics with them. We would also take turns dancing among the tables of diners. No "stage show" per se. I have done this type of "atmosphere" gig a couple of times before, although I wasn't the contact/contracting person. (One of the previous gigs was a "charitable" performance and the other was so long ago I have no idea how much I was paid.)

I quoted $450 (US) for two dancers. (I'm in the greater Los Angeles area)

Haven't been hired and haven't heard back that anyone was hired; gigmasters sends out an email when someone is hired for a gig to which you submit a bid.

I was trying to think of what "modeling" agencies would charge for such a thing and, without having any real info, I landed upon $450. Of course, that might be for a 6-8 hour day . . . of course, standing around looking pretty and smiling is hard duty, but pro belly dancers who actually entertain as well as stand around looking pretty are worth the same for half the amount of time, right? Right???

Or am I crazy? Is that just too much?

Deborah

Just to clarify... Is it two 30 minute sets or one set for 2.5 hours?? Either way, I think $225/dancer is more than reasonable. I did a modeling gig once at a casino and walked around in heels and a showgirl costume for an entire day. Was paid $150 for it, but it was in CT, not LA. Also, they provided the costume. I just provided stockings and shoes (and my body, of course!).

ETA: Another point is that you are dancing in this gig, not just standing around. Even if it's between tables, it's still dancing and you should be paid for your skills as well as just the "pretty girl in costume" pay.

I'm on the east coast but I don't think your quote was too much either.

In LA...for doctors...2 dancers...working for 2 straight hours?
Not out of the question.

I think your bid seems very reasonable/affordable. I think a good frame of reference would be something like a classical guitarist at a wedding. I paid mine $400 for 2 hours of background music during the ceremony & cocktail reception. That was for 1 artist. $450 for two entertainers is a great price.

I think your price was very reasonable.

They might be accustomed to paying quite a bit less, though. I used to be registered with a local 'models-for-events' agency, and usually what they offered me was more like $20/hour, or less. Of course, I'm not an experienced model, and I was mostly offered stuff like handing out moisturizer samples (that's what us older gals do, right?)

They may not really value the dancing. But then they wouldn't deserve you, either.

The rate I've heard quoted by dancers here in NY for atmospheric gigs is $200 per hour or $200 per hour plus $150 for each additional hour. Often with a minimum set of two hours. This would be in line with the guitarist rate quoted above. I almost never get inquiries for this kind of thing but I did one once and I definitely would not want to do it for less than that.

Its true that "models for events" may get paid a lot less, but they are not asking you to just walk around and pose, they requested dancing.

Originally Posted by casbahdance

Haven't been hired and haven't heard back that anyone was hired; gigmasters sends out an email when someone is hired for a gig to which you submit a bid.

They could be thinking about it, looking at their budget, etc. Or they could be searching for dancers through other means other than Gigmasters. If they hired a dancer separate from Gigmasters, how would GM know to email you?

Another "modeling" comparison:

Surgeons convention (S.F.): Assignment: Lie on a (very comfortable) padded table and model TED stockings and somehow manage to make them seem attractive, apparently. $100 for the day. Piece of cake, and that was good money 25 years ago .... YOU aren't just lying around, you are providing the costumes and entertainment--don't forget transportation time, setting up, all the prep--

PS--apparently, we were supposed to be "flirty" with the MD's. I didn't know, didn't care, but was "professional". the promoters were annoyed with me, but paid me anyway ..... (For God's sake, the TED samples were free--what more did the docs want, lol!)

By comparison, your quote seems TOTALLY reasonable!

I think it's absolutely reasonable, but I also think you're in LA where there are at least two troupe leaders I can think of off the top of my head that would half that price just to get the gig. Don't sell out, Deborah! :)

we just had a discussion last night about rates and how to handle initial inquiries, and are charging $300 for three dancers for two 15-20 sets for a wedding. and that's in Fargo, ND.

Thanks for the feedback, everybody!

Originally Posted by nasila

I think it's absolutely reasonable, but I also think you're in LA where there are at least two troupe leaders I can think of off the top of my head that would half that price just to get the gig. Don't sell out, Deborah! :)

But WHY???

If dancers can get $450 for something like this, why underprice??? Is it bragging rights ("Hey, I got this gig for a bunch of doctors . . . " or "I dance all the time")? Is it just to make some money, even if a pittance?

Let's say I did decide to do the gig for half the price. The problem is that I'd probably be very resentful in general -- and pretty mad at myself -- for accepting such low pay. Is there no pride???

Nertz on them all, I say!

Deborah

Originally Posted by aazura

. . . they could be searching for dancers through other means other than Gigmasters. If they hired a dancer separate from Gigmasters, how would GM know to email you?

That's always a possibility, of course. I have yet to get a gig through Gigmasters; I bid on as many as I can, but am not available for nearly as many more. As a matter of fact, I did several gigs at the end of last year that came to me via word of mouth or from my teaching info. Go figure.

Deborah

Not too much at all. Two dancers to provide ambiance and entertainment for a 2.5 hour lunch event for professionals?

However, there may be cheaper alternatives. However x 2, it sounds like you don't want to be the cheaper alternative.

The economy may not be 'recovering' any time soon. This may be the new norm. We're trying to make sure we understand what is sustainable pricing and what is not... we're not trying to 'hold on' with unsustainable pricing until 'things get better.'

Don't know if that helps YOU, but your post prompted the thought.

Originally Posted by casbahdance

If dancers can get $450 for something like this, why underprice??? Is it bragging rights ("Hey, I got this gig for a bunch of doctors . . . " or "I dance all the time")? Is it just to make some money, even if a pittance?

Honestly, YES. I think this is exactly why they do it ,r:;

And no, your rates weren't completely out of line. I'm going to second what Mariyah said - actual dancing is involved, and it sounds like you'll do a lot more than just posing and looking cute. Plus, your valuable time, and wear-and-tear on those expensive sparklies ,r:;

Dancer "ambiance" prices that include dancing should be more than modeling prices. Interesting to note that lingerie or more revealing clothing is double or triple rate and a minimum of one hour.
http://www.reinhardagency.com/bookingPolicies.php
Typical modeling rates range from $150-$250/hour (with a 2 hour minimum for non lingerie). But these girls aren't dancing...and to be honest, the top agencies were charging those rates 20 years ago.
SO... I'd say your rates were REALLY reasonable, if not low. But it also depends upon what your regular show rates are etc.
Following the New York model for ambiance (in relation to their regular gig rate) is I think helpful.

hostessing (standing at the door, smiling, handing out stuff), pays about 15-35€ an hour. slightlly more for 'speciality costuming'.

so these kind of gigs are hard to price

i now tend to go with a minimum of the price of ONE dancing gig and then TOP it UP, because you spend much more time ON site.

so yeah, i think you're price is reasonable, and i'd probably would have charged around 500€ myself.

In Vegas, the ballroom studio I used to manage charged $150 per person per hour.

This scenario would have been a higher quote than yours. Just sayin'

Originally Posted by casbahdance

I received a "gig-alert" from Gigmasters.com, with which I am a subscribing entertainer, and recently bid on the following scenario:

2 1/2 hour "arabian nights"-themed lunch-time gig for "doctors' day" with two dancers. The gig consisted of greeting the docs as they arrived and posing for pics with them. We would also take turns dancing among the tables of diners. No "stage show" per se. I have done this type of "atmosphere" gig a couple of times before, although I wasn't the contact/contracting person. (One of the previous gigs was a "charitable" performance and the other was so long ago I have no idea how much I was paid.)

I quoted $450 (US) for two dancers. (I'm in the greater Los Angeles area)

Haven't been hired and haven't heard back that anyone was hired; gigmasters sends out an email when someone is hired for a gig to which you submit a bid.

I was trying to think of what "modeling" agencies would charge for such a thing and, without having any real info, I landed upon $450. Of course, that might be for a 6-8 hour day . . . of course, standing around looking pretty and smiling is hard duty, but pro belly dancers who actually entertain as well as stand around looking pretty are worth the same for half the amount of time, right? Right???

Or am I crazy? Is that just too much?

Deborah

Your quote was definitely reasonably...for a belly dancer. Unfortunately a lot of people that hire dancers don't realize what they're actually hiring. For instance, I worked as a professional model for a while (stand around, look pretty). I'd get hired for the day and would walk away with $200 if I was lucky. As a dancer, I wouldn't consider doing a gig for less than $200, let alone one that lasts 2.5 hours!!! But the way party planners see it, they can get a model for $150, so why pay more? They don't realize that you've worked so hard to deserve the money you make. (Well, some of us have )