Thread: The Art of Negotiation: How do You Create a Win-Win Situation?

I guess this is a spinoff on the "value added" thread I posted a couple weeks ago.

What I want to explore is how each one of us reacts when a client hesitates on our pricing. We all get 'em. The nice, reasonable people who aren't exactly running to book Suzy Nippletassels just yet, but just might book a 'Tassler in spite of themselves if you don't prove to them in some way that you can give them more for their money.

In my past lifetime as a radio sales rep, we usually went about this in a couple of ways:

1. Give them more of something of less value; i.e. take out a couple of the costly Morning Drive spots and add more evenings and overnights. They get more spots, for the same price, but fewer people listen during off-peak hours.

2. Give 'em something for free. Sometimes, we'd "bonus" them 10 overnight spots.

3. Make their schedule shorter to lower the cost.

4. Tell them, "OK, go to the station down the street - but be warned, you get what you pay for." And hope for the best.

How do you handle the delicate art of negotiation? Do you give them a shorter set? "Bonus" in an extra song or some other perk, for the same price? Drop to the lower end of your sliding scale of rates, without compromising anything? Say "tough nookies, see ya later" and send them gently into the forest of inappropriate tassels?

Let's talk!

I feel that some clients *really* like to negotiate, for them it's simply part of the fun. I usually leave a little bit of wiggle room in my first quote. That way I can lower the price a little if I have to without harming my business.
How that translates in this area. Local minimum is $200/20 min show. I usually charge and get $275 for a typical party ($300 for wedding), but if something is convenient for me and they feel their entire experience is "enhanced" if they feel they saved $25- I can go down to $250. They have to ask a couple times though. Make 'em work for it. ..g.:
If they are not an American audience- I sometimes let them know I can dance closer to 25 minutes- which they always seem to think of as "almost half an hour"- that also makes them feel they are getting more "value" for their $275.
Unless it's a repeat client (pleasant experience and previous good tippers ) I don't combine the "$250" offer and "a few extra minutes" offer. With people who I *know from experience* tip well- I'm happy to be a little flexible if they're going to take care of me very well.
NOTE: the random callers who say "but we'll tip" RARELY do. One time recently I went with instinct and struck a bargain that paid off quite well, but those are the exceptions. He and his family really WANTED the tipping experience as part of the good luck for his son's first birthday. He "paid" me $225- *and* started the tipping with a $50 money shower as per our deal...which brought me to my regular amount- and everyone else tipped like crazy after his lovely example. ..g.:
If they've seen me and specifically want me to dance- price is usually not an issue in the least.
If they're random callers- they sometimes end up going by price - and that's fine. There are a lot of dancers around here who charge less than I do and I'm happy that there is a distribution of work for everyone; as long as those professionals are charging at least the minimum for a stable, sustainable business (profession).

Samira, that's what I've been doing. I'll usually quote my highest (ideal) rate and give them some wiggle room from what I charge to an acceptable regional minimum. If they want less, I give 'em the old "You get what you pay for" and leave them to the wolves.

Today, I got an inquiry and I said "I usually dance for 20 - 25 minutes. That's five songs, each showing a different tempo, feeling or type of prop. (Insert brief description of a typical set). I also like to include some sort of audience participation at the end."

I think if you explicitly spell out exactly what goes into your 20-25 minutes onstage, they'll actually be amazed at how much ground gets covered in that time. It's a good way to manage mutual expectations from that first call. This, I find, makes price a little less of an object when they see exactly what they're getting.

Originally Posted by SatinWorship19

Today, I got an inquiry and I said "I usually dance for 20 - 25 minutes. That's five songs, each showing a different tempo, feeling or type of prop. (Insert brief description of a typical set). I also like to include some sort of audience participation at the end."

..l;,..l;,..l;,We SO think alike.
I want them to know what they are getting, AND differentiate myself from the "vaguely wiggling around for 20 min" dancers. I describe what I do in conversation form as I'm also asking where they are from, if there is a guest of honor they'd want me to get up to dance etc.
Saying "a 20-25 minute show" doesn't spell it out like explaining a whole show. Especially as we're not charging peanuts...or shwarma. If it's a new to bd client, it helps them have a clear picture. If it's an ethnic client who knows what they want, it helps me determine exactly what music and props to use and throwing song titles out there always helps THEM feel more confident that I now what I'm doing.

We really do think so alike, at times, it can be scary! Like we graduated from the same Academy of Bellydance Sales Strategy ..g.:

Scary thing is, I'm noticing a lot of "pros" in my area who offer 45-minute shows for $50 less than what I charge. This seems to be common among folks who either don't know better or don't give a rat's posterior.

When defending my modest set lengths, it's important to show the cohesiveness and structure of my shows. Wouldn't an audience rather see something with a definitive beginning, middle and end, and get a sampling of the different exotic "flavors" of belly dance? It's so much more aesthetically pleasing than random acts of endless flopping that go onnnnnn and onnnnnnn and onnnnnnn. And it takes more artistic skill to put together a real set than to wing it for an hour.

My other common defense? "I'm here to enhance your party, not to monopolize it! I know your guests want to enjoy my show, but I also realize that they want to enjoy each other's company just as much."

People always seem to understand that. After all, Miss Manners warns that it's never becoming of a guest to overstay their welcome at a party! ..l;,

Originally Posted by SatinWorship19

3. Make their schedule shorter to lower the cost.

This is my approach for people who want something substantially cheaper than my normal rate.

Last month, I had someone call wanting to book my "Taste of Belly Dance Package" for a ladies night get together. The TOB package is a fully costumed 2-song performance followed by a lesson, which lasts about an hour. I charge $200 for it. The woman, to say the least, had quite the sticker shock. However, through talking her, it became apparent that the main thing she wanted was the lesson and for it to be light and fun for her friends.

We agreed that I would do a 30 minute mini-lesson with no costume or performance, just my regular teaching gear of yoga pants and a sports bra. I charged her $50, and she was happy as a clam - even gave me a $10 tip as I left. My prep time was minimal, and I was even able to stop at the grocery store for dinner on the way home.

Originally Posted by SatinWorship19

My other common defense? "I'm here to enhance your party, not to monopolize it! I know your guests want to enjoy my show, but I also realize that they want to enjoy each other's company just as much."

People always seem to understand that. After all, Miss Manners warns that it's never becoming of a guest to overstay their welcome at a party! ..l;,

I also think it's very impressive to clients when you try to talk them into a shorter set, even though it might make you less money. A lot of the people who call me start off wanting the 25 minute Full Set, but if it's just a GP birthday party, I know from experience that a 10 minute BellyGram is more than enough. I've had a few clients tell me they knew I was going to be great because it was obvious that I cared more about making their party successful than making a few extra bucks.

Originally Posted by SatinWorship19

3. Make their schedule shorter to lower the cost.

This is something I don't do.
My prep time is the same. I've still made a CD, gotten my props together, painted my face, put on my costume, printed out directions, drove to the venue...all based on years of training and experience and ALL of that together in addition to business costs (which remain the same even for a short show) adds up to the gig cost... saving me 5 or 10 minutes out of 2 hours on THAT day (plus, education, experience etc) isn't going to lower the price from me.
...Laura 2- your situation WAS different as the prep time was changed some. I have cut different deals on "show and class" parties as there is more time to play with...but honestly it wasn't a huge price difference.

I agree that giving potential clients a description of what actually is planned for their entertainment is an excellent thing to do.

I also like the "closer to 25 minutes" for a dancer's full price (on a 20-minute show) can make a huge difference in the mind of the caller. Like SamiraShuruk posted, we're still getting our full price, the client is happy, and I'm not agreeing to a 30-minute gig-of-death.

Deborah

Originally Posted by SamiraShuruk

This is something I don't do.
My prep time is the same. I've still made a CD, gotten my props together, painted my face, put on my costume, printed out directions, drove to the venue...all based on years of training and experience and ALL of that together in addition to business costs (which remain the same even for a short show) adds up to the gig cost... saving me 5 or 10 minutes out of 2 hours on THAT day (plus, education, experience etc) isn't going to lower the price from me.
...Laura 2- your situation WAS different as the prep time was changed some. I have cut different deals on "show and class" parties as there is more time to play with...but honestly it wasn't a huge price difference.

I understand exactly what you mean, SamiraShuruk, but I handle it differently and here's why:

I prefer to do the 10 and 15 minute shows so my pricing reflects that. There isn't a huge price differential between my 10-minute 'gram and my 20-minute full+ gig, but it's enough to get folks to sit up and pay attention, I think.

I might charge more for a 30-minute lesson-only (no costume) than what Laura 2 mentioned, but not by much. I look at this type of thing as if it were a private lesson, except there is more than one person. If I charge $50 per hour for a private lesson, then I think it's reasonable to charge at least that amount for what is, essentially, a private lesson that happens to be a gig. Notice, tho, that the 30-minute gig is priced at about a 60-minute private rate; that's 'cuz -- even though I don't have to don a costume and plan a set -- I've still gotta paint my face, do my hair and travel to the location.

For me, I'd much rather teach for 30 minutes than dance that amount of time any day! Not only that, but these mini teaching gigs could very well produce good referrals. So, once again, I price well those things I prefer to do!

This has been a very interesting thread. I'm excited to read more!

Deborah

Originally Posted by SamiraShuruk

This is something I don't do.
My prep time is the same. I've still made a CD, gotten my props together, painted my face, put on my costume, printed out directions, drove to the venue...all based on years of training and experience and ALL of that together in addition to business costs (which remain the same even for a short show) adds up to the gig cost... saving me 5 or 10 minutes out of 2 hours on THAT day (plus, education, experience etc) isn't going to lower the price from me.

That's one of the major reasons why I don't offer 'Grams.

I have found that if i quote a higher rate ($300), most people will try to negotiate. I will let those negotiations progress to a price that were I not in this business and unfortunate economy, would be my original quote ($250). So that's that.
Next, I will also quote the shorter set for the price - 20 minutes for the amount. Then if they want a longer set, I charge an extra $25 for an extra song. So, I have no problem doing a longer show...I'm already in make-up, a costume and on location but I've regained some extra cash, thereby conceding only $25 off my original quote.
Negotiation is a subtle art. Customers feel like they are getting a good deal because they managed to talk me down from my original price AND got me to tack on an extra five minutes on my set. It's free stuff for the customers but they don't need to know that it cost you absolutely nothing.

Is it sneaky? Yes. Does it work? Absolutely.

P.S. Breaking down your entire show, detailing what will go into it specifically helps the gp understand exactly what they are getting for their money. Going into specifics has often brought "straying" customers looking for a good deal to call back and hire me over vague claims of dance and entertainment.

This is a great thread!

I am currently charging the minimum pro rate for my area and I'm afraid to charge more because I assume people will just go with the cheaper rate every time.

How do you tactfully reply when you quote your price and they say "I just got a quote from dancer X that was $25 cheaper".

Asra - I would just say, "well there are many dancers in the area and we all have different prices based on our level of experience and training." It's kind of a tactful way of saying you get what you pay for.