Thread: Youtube stealing your business?

So I was looking on Youtube.com today and saw some belly dancers giving "free" lessons but also soliciting their business with their video.

What I am wondering is... As an Instructor, do you think these videos are stealing your business?

I was going to add a video but thought it may seem cruel to single out one person when there are so many out there.

It is what it is. Those videos might be sucky or downright WTF-worthy, but if they have sufficiently piqued a prospective student's interest in belly dance, then the student will most likely come to a class to get the "real deal." In most cases, I doubt YouTube or even DVD's will ever render live instructors obsolete.

It's actually not a terrible idea from a marketing standpoint, as long as the clips are labeled as tasters/teasers, rather than lessons.

i had students ask me for youtube vids they could use to practice at home. in the weekly email i sent out i gave a long explanation about why it's important to have a live teacher and that i had concerns that even if i showed them clips with sound techniques it might lead them to bad technique via the links, but if they wanted something to practice with between classes i would recommend X and Y dvds.
the next week the class went for 5 to 2 students. (mostly i think they had schedule problems but i always wonder.....)

Yes but these videos show technique and teach musicality and some are a series of videos. So they aren't really in the category (from my stand point) of "WTF-worthy", not labeled as "sample of what you can find in my class", and they do not appear to be supplemental material for their students from a class.

I think giving away anything for free could potentially take away business... We all will freely critique someone's YouTube performance upon their request. Some instructors actually charge to critique a video performance. The same is really with any advice or knowledge sharing.

If given the opportunity between a great YouTube video and a great instructor, I believe the serious student will choose live instruction

I started learning with instructional youtube videos! But when I started, there weren't as many out there, they were actually hard to find.
I used them until I was able to find classes and buy DVD's, at which point I grew out of them.
They helped me learn the very basics but I still wanted more, and here I am, still dancing, shelling out my money in music, costumes, lessons, workshops, events...

I think most people who want to learn belly dance will come to class whether or not those videos are out there (provided they can find classes in their area). In fact, I think those videos probably inspire some people to take classes who would never otherwise have thought of the possibility. And mostly anyone who just learns by watching videos instead of going to class would probably not be interested in class anyway, even if they did not have access to video tutorials. Some people are just interested in learning a few moves. There is nothing wrong with that.

Originally Posted by yameyameyame

I think most people who want to learn belly dance will come to class whether or not those videos are out there (provided they can find classes in their area). In fact, I think those videos probably inspire some people to take classes who would never otherwise have thought of the possibility. And mostly anyone who just learns by watching videos instead of going to class would probably not be interested in class anyway, even if they did not have access to video tutorials. Some people are just interested in learning a few moves. There is nothing wrong with that.

I agree. Most people who will settle for learning from youtube clips only weren't ever going to come to class (because of shyness, finances, or having only a passing interest in the subject). And a few might discover the dance there, get intrigued, do a little more googling, and discover what they're missing in terms of instruction, community, haflas, feedback, etc. I'd think a visit or two to Bhuz (on a good day LOL) would be enough to make them realize what they're missing.

As a teacher, I love them! If I have a student who has difficulty grasping a particular move or two, I will send them a link so that they can practice between classes. A Youtube video certainly doesn't compare to a live instructor, but it sure as hell beats most people's memory. I have found that giving specific links to my students does make them practice more before coming back to class. I also allow them to record combinations that I've taught and recommend DVDs that use a technique that is similar to mine. But practicing with an hour-long DVD is a lot more daunting to procrastinators and busy people than practicing a few moves with decent Youtube videos is.

I'm not sure these videos cut into your business as much from an academic standpoint as that they may feed the illusion that a student who has studied them is a "real" dancer and could be soliciting gigs and competing with you that way. I would guess that the main market for these clips is someone who isn't much of a potential student anyway--either because she or he is a young person who couldn't afford and/or have transportation to weekly classes, someone who lives in an area without a local teacher, or even a student who is too cheap to pay for what they think they can get for free. Anyone who is serious about learning and could (logistically and financially) take actual classes with an in-person teacher would probably choose to do so over these freebie online lessons. It certainly is possible that these lessons both encourage the interested to seek traditional classes, and discourage the flakes from thinking the dance is so easy anyone can do it without training.

I do see another positive to these classes. In a world where teachers have no minimum standards of competency, these online lessons provide an opportunity for students with weaker teachers to learn what they're not learning in their regular classes. OTOH, Bhuz will never run out of material to debate about 3/4 shimmies as long as these dancers are out there uploading clips. [Edited to clarify that I wasn't referring to what Serafina wrote about using the clips with her students. I was thinking of the videos filling in gaps for teachers who don't teach things they should know as part of their minimum competency as an instructor, not using the videos as supplementary teaching materials.]

You can learn almost anything for 'free' (you pay for internet, library memberships sometimes, driving, copying, time etc) but in the end, a lot of people want real live people to teach them. That is one of the reasons online classes haven't taken off. Also, this is a hobby, not school or a license you HAVE to do, so people may start with videos but if they are serious they will usually want real lessons. And finally, its much more social with a real person!

Originally Posted by raqFariha

the next week the class went for 5 to 2 students. (mostly i think they had schedule problems but i always wonder.....)

Did the class attendence go back up?

I refer my students to ones that I know are good, by reputable instructors. It helps them to remember the moves and be able to practice after they've gotten live instruction. I do warn them that a lot of them are bad, and to be very careful on just randomally selecting them.

I've never lost a student because of it. I think it can be a good resource when used appropriately.

First of all, I pity anyone trying to learn from videos!
But having free finger cymbal lessons on my youtube channel reaches more people than I could personally, and also allows me to point my students to appropriate home study since we don't have much time in class.

In a way it seems to me like I'm giving dancers a gift. Now I wonder if I'm keeping anyone out of class? But I'm not taking them down at this point.
They're very popular & the comments I get touch my heart.
I'm happy to share cymbal drills with people. Each clip is actually a companion to a written article in Zaghareet magazine, so I guess the same question could be asked of 'how-to" magazine articles?

Originally Posted by maurazebra

Did the class attendence go back up?

it did not. I'm told that 5 is a really big class for their center though. I've found out since then that one of the students broke her foot, another fell down stairs and broke her tail bone. I'm looking for other places to teach at and hopefully when they're all healed they'll join us.

Ah ha! DVDs 0, RaqFariha 5.

my clips get me gigs, students and sell dvd's.

I can't get the quote button to work.

Personally, I don't think it takes away from your business.
As one Bhuzzer pointed out; "I think most people who want to learn belly dance will come to class whether or not those videos are out there (provided they can find classes in their area). In fact, I think those videos probably inspire some people to take classes who would never otherwise have thought of the possibility."

This has been my case for a while, and I have looked to youtube, to find others that teach in my area. I wanted to see how they danced (I haven't found any).

Zamora - Youtube made me want your DVD'S! You are awesome!

There were other DVD's I would NEVER have bought, if I hadn't had a preview (even if it was an intire performance that I could download), I still wanted the original.

It all depends on the situation of the person.

When I find something I like on youtube, I want the DVD, so I can watch it on t.v!

you have to make youtube work FOR you. the other studios in town either teach only routenes or it is fusion. 1 has no clips up, the other offers clips that turn clients to us. i do have some teaching clips, but not enough is shown to learn from youtube....geesh!
i always say, "watch the youtube, and make sure this is what you want".9 times outta 10, we get the job!

Originally Posted by zamora

you have to make youtube work FOR you. the other studios in town either teach only routenes or it is fusion. 1 has no clips up, the other offers clips that turn clients to us. i do have some teaching clips, but not enough is shown to learn from youtube....geesh!
i always say, "watch the youtube, and make sure this is what you want".9 times outta 10, we get the job!

This is exactly right. You show just enough to whet somebody's appetite. I know from what I have seen of your clips that if I ever WERE in Fresno I would look you up for a class in veil or floor. Other well-known teachers do the same - the YouTube footage is like a movie trailer.

I've got to say I love the "free" footage that is out there though. Not teaching, I never bother looking at "how to do X" on YouTube, but movie clips, footage from shows, footage taken while travelling, footage of somebody's private with a famous Egyptian dancer etc. You learn lots, but you also know you can't *only* learn from those videos.

FWIW belly dance is not the only form where this happens. There are tons of tango, salsa etc demonstrations to learn from on YouTube and probably ballet etc as well.

It's a changing market faster and faster in the 21st century. The music industry has basically tanked and now re-inventing itself due to the internet! To me Youtube clips are like any other medium or media form of expression that can be great, good, bad, terrible... Same as books, movies, dvds, cds, tv etc.