Thread: HA! HAhahahahahaha!

I just received a request for a quote for a corporate gig- 100-150 guests, at a golf course, they want a belly dancer for 5 HOURS, and their budget is UNDER $100! ,f::

Ummmm, no. I WILL respond to the request for a quote, however, and I will ask for more information (5 hours? How long do you REALLY want me to dance?) and respond with a proper quote.

This should be fun.

.w.: Yikes! I know the economy is bad but, have they EVER hired a performer/entertainer before? Yup, got the $ for the golf course and refreshments, but OOPS! forgot to budget for the entertainment. NOT!

Do fill us in on the "response."

FIVE HOURS?! holy bageesuz!

..l;, *wipes tear from eye* oh, that's a good one.

Do they want you to belly dance or do they want you to be there all pretty in your costume? I have a price for being atmosphere on my website. But trust me, it is much more than $20 an hour!

{{{HUGS}}}

Why don't you quote them the price for you to walk around in costume like a clown or a Marilyn Monroe impersonator for five hours? Clearly they aren't expecting you to dance that long. No audience wants to watch anybody dancing any style for five straight hours, and if they're just looking for someone to be moving wallpaper, then whatever--give them the going rate for any other performer in an outfit and explain that if they want you to dance, well, that costs extra...a lot extra.

Yes, I'm guessing, too, that they're looking for a hot model with a bellydance costume who might strut around in character and wiggle occasionally. There are lots of girls who would do that, and it doesn't require much training or a pro costume to meet the customer's expectation.

I doubt they give a damn about hiring a trained dancer. That's so often the case, unfortunately.

It would be a long shot, but probably the best way to convert this to an actual gig would be to engage them in a respectful dialogue. I'd bid my going rate for a 25 minute show, with an explanatory note that " I can see from your bid request that what you're really looking for is someone to be on hand to add atmosphere. Obviously at my regular rates that wouldn't be cost-effective for you. But if you're interested in ending your day at the 19th hole with a real performance by a professional entertainer, let's talk. My show would feature exotic music, swirling silks, sword balancing, audience participation and Kodak moments for all. I can offer you a crowd-pleasing show that people will be talking about for months after the event. Check out my video clips online at Belly Dance by Lauren and the Hips Afire Bellydancers and call or e-mail me to discuss your needs!"

It's natural to feel indignant when we get these requests. But if you can push past the feeling and treat the customer with respect, you *might* be able to salvage a real gig. Remember that they're not trying to be insulting, they just don't know any better!

Of course if someone offers to strut around in a costume for $20/hour they'll probably take it, and they'll all walk away thinking THAT was a bellydancer. So sad.

As long as you're getting paid comparable wages to the Sarah Palin impersonator who has to walk around winking at guests and saying "You Betcha!" all night, moving wallpaper jobs aren't necessarily the worst gigs out there. Some dancers rationalize them by saying that at least they are going to show up in a well fitting, expensive costume, as opposed to some girl off the street with a harem girl outfit from the Halloween store. If someone wants to subsidize a dancer's costume buying by paying them to walk around showing them off, then maybe they can leverage those appearances into advertising for real gigs. Most folks have never seen a real dance costume up close, and they will want to ask about it.

Personally, I think moving wallpaper gigs are somewhat demeaning. They're not paying you for your talent or your art--they're paying you to look glamorous and exotic. Party organizers don't usually hire ballet dancers to walk around in tutus or painters to stroll through the crowd carrying palettes and canvases, so why should we be dragged into their Orientalist fantasy shtick? Certainly if the gig appears to be demeaning to the dancer as a person and she's likely to be subjected to verbal or physical abuse from obnoxious and/or drunk party guests, that would be a definite NO, no matter how much they pay.

I don't find them demeaning, but I don't do wallpaper gigs. I hate making small talk and joshing around with people I don't know - it's one of the reasons I won't hang around after a gig except to politely collect my pay and maybe have a few pictures taken. The thought of doing it for hours, dressed in an uncomfortable costume, makes me want to curl up in the fetal position. I think it's the sort of thing that you really have to have an outgoing and sparkling personality for.

Originally Posted by Lauren_

It's natural to feel indignant when we get these requests. But if you can push past the feeling and treat the customer with respect, you *might* be able to salvage a real gig. Remember that they're not trying to be insulting, they just don't know any better!

Lauren, as usual, is completely correct. ..g.:

Originally Posted by Lauren_

It would be a long shot, but probably the best way to convert this to an actual gig would be to engage them in a respectful dialogue. I'd bid my going rate for a 25 minute show, with an explanatory note that ...
It's natural to feel indignant when we get these requests. But if you can push past the feeling and treat the customer with respect, you *might* be able to salvage a real gig. Remember that they're not trying to be insulting, they just don't know any better!
..

Yes, Lauren. Very well put, and from experience it CAN work! Sometimes these people truly don't know better and respond well to a professional and polite explanation (such as your example). ..g.:

Originally Posted by Tourbeau

..
Personally, I think moving wallpaper gigs are somewhat demeaning. They're not paying you for your talent or your art--they're paying you to look glamorous and exotic. Party organizers don't usually hire ballet dancers to walk around in tutus or painters to stroll through the crowd carrying palettes and canvases, so why should we be dragged into their Orientalist fantasy shtick?

To be fair- I've never heard of "Ballet fantasy parties", "Ballet Russe Princess Parties", "Artist Theme parties" or "Painting Princess Parties".
I suppose the "Ballet Russe Princess" party would have to serve caviar and vodka. The "Artist Theme Party" wouldn't serve food. They'd be "starving artists".
I HAVE seen a Parisian party- complete with Can-Can girls, Mimes, "French Maids" (servers) AND caricature artists (not wandering however) and a large Eiffel Tower ice sculpture. How would a French person see that I wonder?
In all seriousness- the more common "themes" simply provide more creative outlets for decor, food, entertainment and music. I see no reason for it to get my panties in a bunch about it.
NOT that I am a supporter of "wall paper" gigs.
Last summer I did a party for a nuclear physicist convention. They had a flamenco dancer with guitar player, myself and some can-can girls all providing entertainment. They DID ask all of us to stay and wander around. The can-can girls were the only ones to do so. I negotiated a full priced second show out of the request. ..g.:

Originally Posted by Tourbeau

Certainly if the gig appears to be demeaning to the dancer as a person and she's likely to be subjected to verbal or physical abuse from obnoxious and/or drunk party guests, that would be a definite NO, no matter how much they pay.

Based on this and an earlier thread it seems you've had really BAD party experiences, Tourbeau.

Originally Posted by SamiraShuruk

I HAVE seen a Parisian party- complete with Can-Can girls, Mimes, "French Maids" (servers) AND caricature artists (not wandering however) and a large Eiffel Tower ice sculpture. How would a French person see that I wonder?

We have a festival in Milwaukee called Bastille Days, which features most of the above and more wandering through the crowd for atmosphere. Oddly enough, they have hired Belly Dancers before, even though I have no idea what that has to do with the theme.

I'm not totally opposed to moving wallpaper gigs, but I need more than $20 an hour to work as an independent contractor booked a few hours at a time by a client.

Who works for that much? Not graphic designers, writers, plumbers, tree trimmers. Most people would expect to pay more that that to someone who cleans their gutters or their house.

$20 an hour might be a reasonable pay rate for an employee, who doesn't have advertising, supplies, self-employment taxes, insurance, or their own unemployment, FICA, social security and health insurance to pay...

WOW. "Moving decor" ethics aside, this is truly a "special" lead. I'd kinda feel bad about myself if I did a gig where the golf clubs cost more than me!

Any updates for us?

When I get home from teaching tonight, I'm going to respond to the request and see what they say. I'm not opposed to the "moving wallpaper," but I would charge a significant amount to do so. I LOVE the idea of a show at the 19th hole!

I don't feel indignant or insulted- amused, yes! I know they just don't understand. I have a feeling that there won't be a ton of dancers fighting for this job, considering that it's outside the metro area on a workday afternoon. I'm a stay-at-home mom, so I'd need to get a full day's childcare to do it, which will add to my fee (as will travel). I'm going to respond professionally and will give them a chance to let me know if they're looking for wallpaper or dancing, and will quote them an appropriate amount.

Originally Posted by Lauren_

I'm not totally opposed to moving wallpaper gigs, but I need more than $20 an hour to work as an independent contractor booked a few hours at a time by a client.
Who works for that much? Not graphic designers, writers, plumbers, tree trimmers. Most people would expect to pay more that that to someone who cleans their gutters or their house.

The New York yahoo pro dancer board has recommended minimum rates for "ambiance" gigs. I forget the exact rates but it's something like
$150/hour for the first 2 hours, $100/hour after that, with a 3 hour minimum.
That's not exact, AND that was from a few years ago.

Originally Posted by Tourbeau

Party organizers don't usually hire ballet dancers to walk around in tutus or painters to stroll through the crowd carrying palettes and canvases, so why should we be dragged into their Orientalist fantasy shtick?

Oddly enough, we've had the cast of the local Nutcracker production at two different events: Santa's arrival at the mall and for a hotel grand opening. The mall gig did involve a parade of sorts to light the tree. The hotel gig was for them to greet people in front of the 'winter wonderland wedding' room and hand out programs.

Don't knock a stand and smiling gig until you know what it's about. The hotel grand opening had a $40K+ budget and a few hundred people attended with special tours of the facilities for event planners.