Thread: What type of flooring to put in over concrete?

Suggestions?

Any kind of flooring you would like.

If you can put in a wooden frame over the concrete and then lay your flooring over that, it will be much better for a dance floor.

Look up how to do a floating floor/sprung floor... it's better on dancers feet and knees.

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprung_floor[/ame]
[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floating_floor[/ame]

My friend is using these:

ThermalDry Floor Matting System - Dry Basement Floor

But this looks more practical for a dancer:

Basement Wood Flooring Options - Mold Resistant Wood Floor by Total Basement Finishing

I just put a cork floating floor, with an underlay made for this type of flooring, in my basement. Had it in one room--the guest room--before, and now have it in the main basement room where I've created a rehearsal space in the corner. This was just completed this past week, so I can't speak from long experience, but it seems great so far.

One layer of 1/2" foam insulation going N & S. A layer of 1/2" plywood going E & W. What ever you are putting over it going N & S. Personally, I like the laminate click in place flooring which is out.

{{{HUGS}}}

Originally Posted by tahiradancer

One layer of 1/2" foam insulation going N & S. A layer of 1/2" plywood going E & W. What ever you are putting over it going N & S. Personally, I like the laminate click in place flooring which is out.

Don't forget your vapor barrier.

Ladies, I am wondering the same thing except I am looking at renting out a large studio space, one 800 sq ft studio and the other is 1096. It's a bare concrete floor right now, so it's LOT of flooring. We can't afford a full professionally sprung floor but are wondering about the foam/plywood/laminate route. (or cork/nice plywood/whatever on top. We don't like the look of marley.)

I'm being told by flooring people that you can't just have plywood floating over foam, you have to build a lattice of wood strips sitting on foam squares, then nail the plywood to this. Apparently the click-together laminate is not recommended for this kind of floor as it will come "un-clicked" very easily.

Any ideas? We even thought about using those EVA foam puzzle pieces over the floor to start with, and then upgrading to a serious sprung floor when we have the money. Is that crazy? I worry it'd get damaged easily and look cheap. We are planning on having events in the space so it needs to look decent!

Any help is hugely appreciated!

www.stagestep.com they also have financing.

I just opened a 1900 sq ft studio, and bought used subfloor and bought some new. You need a vapor barrier, low mositure, and patience! But I love my floor. I have a marley top.

Also, if anyone is looking, I have xtra marley I'm trying to unload at about 1/2 the price of it new, with some pieces still new.

I've looked at StageStep and it looks like all of the rubber floors require a subfloor, which means the whole system is not afforable, really. Also I really prefer something that doesn't look so industrial...but I realize my budget will dictate how picky I can be!

Does anyone know if the StageStep floors can go directly over concrete? Which ones?

Originally Posted by laurasbelly

We don't like the look of marley.

You don't need marley if your primary use of the floor will be low-impact movement such as belly dance or yoga. Marley's primary function is to provide a safe surface for ballet, to ensure that when a dancer lands from a flying leap she doesn't skid into an injury. But if you're not planning to do any soaring leaps or pointe work, you don't really need marley.

Truth is, everything can go over concrete. But for the sake of your knees, you may not want it to unless there is a thick padding built into what ever you are putting down. Too much time standing, dancing and exercising on concrete is very hard on knees, ankles and lower backs.

I haven't done a floor on a large space in a long time. Then we did a full suspended floor with frame. We used battleship linoleum laminate on the top layer. We had a marley to put over it, but seldom used it except for performances. For smaller spaces - such as my one stall garage - I have used the method I described above.

I hope this helps.

{{{HUGS}}}

Oh, just found this. You might find it of interest.

http://www.sprungfloors.com/build_yo...ung_floor.html

Originally Posted by laurasbelly

Any ideas? We even thought about using those EVA foam puzzle pieces over the floor to start with, and then upgrading to a serious sprung floor when we have the money. Is that crazy? I worry it'd get damaged easily and look cheap. We are planning on having events in the space so it needs to look decent!

Won't this be too grabby for dancing? I tend to think of this kind of flooring as being more about shock absorbing than the kind of surface you need for dancing, which needs to have some cushioning, but also has to be smooth enough to not put up too much resistance on the soles. If this is going to be for a studio, will it be problematic if you have students who want to wear heeled shoes (i.e., would it get damaged with a ballroom or character shoe)? How do you clean it adequately? With a lot of dancers going barefoot, will the foam develop a feet-y smell over time? The Wondermat site says their flooring does not absorb water, but it can grow algae on unembossed surfaces if not adequately dried out...

Originally Posted by Tourbeau

Won't this be too grabby for dancing? I tend to think of this kind of flooring as being more about shock absorbing than the kind of surface you need for dancing, which needs to have some cushioning, but also has to be smooth enough to not put up too much resistance on the soles. If this is going to be for a studio, will it be problematic if you have students who want to wear heeled shoes (i.e., would it get damaged with a ballroom or character shoe)? How do you clean it adequately? With a lot of dancers going barefoot, will the foam develop a feet-y smell over time? The Wondermat site says their flooring does not absorb water, but it can grow algae on unembossed surfaces if not adequately dried out...

I have to agree with Tourbeau. It may offer too much resistance for spins, turns, etc.

Yes you are both of course totally right, that thought was in a moment of madness when a $0.99 /sq ft floor was sounding reeaaal good. But go big or go home, right? At this point I'm thinking basic sprung floor with something like glue-down cork on top. Just wish there was a cheaper way.

This is an affordable alternative but it does sound unusual. Build a frame from 1"x2", you can use construction adhesive to secure the frame to the concrete. Lay plywood over the frame, secure with screws, add another layer with the grain facing the other direction (first layer horizontal, second vertical - or vice-versa), secured with screws. The floor can be stained and sealed, to save time consider the products that accomplish the task in one step. 3 layers of stain and sealant is ideal. Be sure to read the instructions regarding how long to allow each treatment to cure. The cross directions of the plywood on the 1"x2" frame create a type sprung floor. Of course you could add cork or another upper surface but the stain and sealant works great, too. Also very affordable. We actually like dark stain on the plywood, it creates a tiger-type pattern. (Forgot to mention, be certain to seal the concrete prior to installing the frame, to create a type vapor-barrier.)

If you decide to research this technique be aware decking plywood is not an option, you need the type that has one smooth side. Otherwise splinters can be a concern.

1 x 2's or 1 x 4's work great for this. You do 4' x 4' squares in such a way that the edge of the plywood hits the center of the 1 x 4. (I used finish nails.) Top layer can be varnished or you can put down linoleum. Depending on budget and time constraints.

Now, technically this isn't a true suspended floor. Because you don't have rubber / foam donuts under the joints, but in a pinch it will do. Just suggest to the dancers that they don't stand on the joints!

See what happens when I get a little bit of time to think and access some of my files? I could be dangerous!

{{{HUGS}}}

We built our own 18" by 20" sprung dance floor over a bare concrete floor! I am not too sure of the specifics, because my husband did all the work. Somewhere we might have pictures, I know he was thinking of doing an instructables on this, but I don't think he finished. If you want more details, let me know and I can ask him (he's out of town at the moment). Please please excuse the horrible description that follows, hopefully this will make sense to the garage tool using type of people out their. If not, ask me what in the heck I am talking about

Basically all you need is laminate flooring (I chose cherry wood), plywood sheets (the more expensive kind with a hard top), 1" by 2" boards (we used cheap but not warped pieces), and foam strips (we took a big sheet and cut it ourselves).

I am not sure about the process, I might correct this later-he did all the work! But I think he took the 1" by 2" boards and attached them to the bottom of the plywood to make a grid pattern (can get measurements later, I think there is space of 6 or 8 inches between the pieces), which attaches the plywood to itself and provides a basic framework. In the hollow spaces between of the grid he put strips of foam (cut to 1" by 2" pieces I think, and are the same thickness as the 1" by 2" boards so everything is level) and glued them to the plywood. Space the foam pieces just a couple of inches apart (not sure exactly-again I will have to ask). Flip that bad boy over after it is dry, then you have your sub floor. (To make a flippable grid work, you have to places the edges of some 1" by 2" planks so they act as a joint between pieces of plywood. Flip, then screw together from the top.) Once your subfloor is down, there is no need to attach it to the concrete floor because the weight of the floor holds it down. Once you have this subfloor together you just lay the laminate flooring on top and finish off with edge pieces. You can either buy the kind that are sold for sprung dance floors or use some of the extra wood to make a nice edge-under the nice edge put a few more pieces of the 1" by 2" to keep it nice and solid across.

I have been using this floor since August for an average of 12-15 hours a week, for wedding dance couples, bellydance classes, and my own personal use. So far no problems and I can absolutely tell the difference between this and a normal floor. My joints are so happy! The whole thing cost less than $600, because we cut the foam ourselves and didn't use specialty edges.

I will taking this floor apart in mid May when we move, so I will be able to see how the bottom of the floor held up. It took my husband just a few days of hard work to get this together all by himself. He has never done anything like this and only just barely fits the "handyman" set of skills. He has more determination than knowledge, and it was still a relatively simple task. So for someone who actually knows how to do this kind of thing, has a nice set of tools, I imagine it wouldn't be too hard at all. And it definitely was affordable!

WOW this is all extremely helpful! We would be heavily involved in the construction so yes please if you could email pics, or your husband's instructions that would be amazing! My email is laurasbelly (at) gmail (dot) com. Thanks so much!!!!

I will see what I can do, my husband is in Portland with tonsillitis and can't remember where the pictures went =( Hopefully I can find them on one of the computers, but I will definitely get actual measurements in a couple of days when he can talk again =)

Thank you so much! Our contractor has some ideas about putting down strips of strapping, securing foam in between, and plywood over that. I think the strapping would have to have foam under it for it to be a properly sprung floor though...

From my limited knowledge of technical terms, that sounds exactly like what we did. There isn't any padding on the straps, they act as a support framework for the floor. Without it the floor would be too springy and roll too much when you walked across it. Even with all the layers we have, you can actually feel the floor give when you move. So the straps and the foam strips are all the same height (imagining there was no top) which is what creates the sprung floor. We got this idea from a dance flooring company's explanation of how their sprung floor's are created. (I can't remember who's website though) We just couldn't afford $10 or more a square foot. The key to this floor is having a support framework, but also spacing the foam-gives it more "bounce" than just a solid foam slab underneath. Better explanation can be found here-

O'Mara Sprung Floors | What is a Sprung Dance Floor? How Do Sprung Dance Floors Differ From Wooden Floors? These guys use 3" by 3" squares under their floor, 3/4 thick. There is a chance we may have used thicker foam, but am not entirely sure.

I can't find our pictures anywhere, but they could be in several locations =( So here is a side view diagram
http://www.pamsacademyofdance.net/As...ages/floor.gif

The "sub floor" is our concrete base, the "high density foam" is the foam layer (spaced throughout the floor, not just at corners) and also your base of straps, the "first wood layer" is plywood, the "second wood layer" is the cherry laminate we used. Because I am not a ballet dancer we did not need the "dance surface" layer.

Hope this helps!

Reyveka

I just noticed something today. There is a very thin layer of foam between the plywood and the top floor. Very thin, like 1/16 of an inch! I will try to see if I can find out the name of this foam, something is printed on it, but I am not sure what. I suppose we put this in just for extra cushion? I will investigate tomorrow.