Thread: Are Costume Values Like Car Values?

So I've been kinda wondering about costume prices lately. It seems to me that they are like car prices. The instant you drive it off the lot (buy it and wear it), it decreases in value and then decreases in value over the life of the car/costume. Some costumes though, seem to retain their value over time, depending on the designer. Are there some costumes that seem to GAIN in price over time? Over the years, How much money do you think you've lost on reselling your costumes... or what percentage of your expenses does costume resale value make up? Not really sure what I'm asking... just some thoughts I had. I'm wondering if any of you have any comments on this.

I like your comparison. FWIW, I think they do depreciate pretty fast. I haven't been dancing that long, but costume prices are dropping like rocks. The coin costumes seem to be the ones that hold their value pretty well, but just my 2 cents.

Edna

I think it's supply and demand. There are always designer costumes coming out on the swap meet, several each day. It would be interesting to tally up how many costumes get added in a week. With such a supply, you can easily wait it out and try to get things for a lower price. The lousy economy isn't helping any.

I don't perform a lot- there are precious few venues here & fewer & fewer private gigs, it seems. I buy/swap/sell 2 or 3 costumes a year, usually at about a 10-15% loss with relatively little wear & tear put in by me. for gigs, when determining price over all on the gig, I figure $50 a show- that may be a little high, but you just never know which gig is going to produce spilled liquid or hem stains or snagged veils or whatever, and if I start doing more frequent gigs, that probably means more costume swap/purchases. That's all in my head & may not be an accurate assesment- I just divided what I was actually loosing each year on costume swaps by the number of actual paying gigs I get each year. & I do track depreciation in Quickbooks.

I would really love to know how this compares to other people's figures.

There was a day a few years back a Bella could go for the same or more than it was bought for, used or not in less than 30 min......I think I once sold one in 5.....now it is taking me months to sell one for 3/4 the price but twice as nice.....I think it is the economy

Originally Posted by annwyn

There was a day a few years back a Bella could go for the same or more than it was bought for, used or not in less than 30 min......I think I once sold one in 5.....now it is taking me months to sell one for 3/4 the price but twice as nice.....I think it is the economy

I agree with Annwyn. When I joined Bhuz a couple years ago, I BOUGHT lots of pretty sparklies -- and paid full price, without haggling or asking a gazillion quesions, took my chances and kept what fit, reposted the rest -- and "the rest" would sell rather quickly. When I lost all my work and first started to post some of my treasures, I would get the full asking price and they would often sell as fast as I bought. But now, I think the economy has caused this phenomenon to tank! For about the last year and a half or two, no one seems to be able to get even close to what a costume is worth, or what it originally cost the buyer. And we all seem to be in the same boat -- ..cr.: I would have pounced on about six costumes that are on the board earlier!!

So do dancers who purchase high-end cossies pay the high prices because they feel they're guaranteed to recoup its costs after using it for a few months?

Originally Posted by Margaret

So do dancers who purchase high-end cossies pay the high prices because they feel they're guaranteed to recoup its costs after using it for a few months?

For myself, not necessarily. I buy what I like as long as it's in my budget and don't think about any re-sale value. These days all of my sales are priced at the rock bottom lowest I will go... Which seems to move costumes rather quickly. Im also a dancer who seems to put wear abd tear on her costumes quite easily- it's probably because I'm accident prone and can't sew- so I dint feel too bad about buying high and selling low.

On a side note, I have noticed a couple of my things re-posted for more (sometimes quite a bit more) than what they paid me for it.... I guess everybodys trying to make a buck. Ethical? *shrug* just kind of amusing when I "bump" written 6000 times.

Originally Posted by Margaret

So do dancers who purchase high-end cossies pay the high prices because they feel they're guaranteed to recoup its costs after using it for a few months?

You know... that's one of the things that I think about when I make a costume purchase. Part of it is the durability of the costume, and the other part is the possible resale or trade value. I always take really good care of my costumes and fix them right away, just so that they last longer and sell higher when I do go to resell them... obviously not worth much anymore as everything is going dirt cheap now.

It sucks how the economy is affecting our costume resale. I've decreased a $900 bella to $400 and it STILL hasn't sold! I've had the thing up on and off all summer and fall. ugh.

A lot of interesting thoughts here. I wasn't on the swap boards when they were hopping like that, so I had thought that resale values always plummeted like this... though this time last year it wasn't this bad. So really it seems like costume resale values are mainly determined by the economy and how well we dancers are doing gig wise.

When I went back and calculated my losses due to costume resale value and my gains from teaching, gigs, etc. I'm actually in the hole! I had never really figured on putting costume resale and maintenance expenses into my budgeting, but I am definitely going to set aside for that now!

Originally Posted by tabitha

For myself, not necessarily. I buy what I like as long as it's in my budget and don't think about any re-sale value. These days all of my sales are priced at the rock bottom lowest I will go... Which seems to move costumes rather quickly. Im also a dancer who seems to put wear abd tear on her costumes quite easily- it's probably because I'm accident prone and can't sew- so I dint feel too bad about buying high and selling low.

On a side note, I have noticed a couple of my things re-posted for more (sometimes quite a bit more) than what they paid me for it.... I guess everybodys trying to make a buck. Ethical? *shrug* just kind of amusing when I "bump" written 6000 times.

Maybe some people forgot what they bought it for? I've done that a couple times... couldn't remember what I bought it for, so I just put down what I figured was fair.

I definitely think about re-sale value when I am purchasing a costume. As I have seen first hand, trying to sell a no name costume means I have had to discount it so low that it makes it not even worth getting rid of. Oh, and that is for a costume I have worn a couple times only! Only high end brands for me now if I plan on re-selling later. If I buy a no-name my intention will be to dance in it until it is falling apart

As a buyer, I would never knowingly pay more or even full price for something used than it cost new. I can see, possibly, if something hasn't been worn at all--the person ordered it, tried it on, and decided not to keep it--then I might consider it, but even that's unlikely. Why would I do that, when I could order my own new costume for the same price, but custom made to fit me? (I understand that sometimes people don't want to wait, but I'm not usually in that position.)

I am looking for a specific costume right now, and the one I want, in my size, was posted not long ago (and still hasn't sold, to my knowledge). But it's posted for about the same price as what I could pay for it from Dahlal. The poster claims she paid almost $100 more in shipping, and that may be true, because of her location. But her location is not my problem. Unless I could get it for a fair amount less than it would cost me to buy new, then I'd rather buy directly from Dahlal, with whom I've dealt before and know to be helpful and reputable.

I do understand that sometimes people have fallen in love with a particular style that is no longer available. There's one dress I wish I'd bought when I had the chance, and I'm kicking myself for passing it up. However, I still wouldn't buy it used for the same or more than what the new price was.

To me, a used item is worth, at best, 75% of the original price, if it is in like-new condition. If not, then it is not worth more than 50% of the original cost.

Originally Posted by CalgaryBibi

As a buyer, I would never knowingly pay more or even full price for something used than it cost new. I can see, possibly, if something hasn't been worn at all--the person ordered it, tried it on, and decided not to keep it--then I might consider it, but even that's unlikely. Why would I do that, when I could order my own new costume for the same price, but custom made to fit me? (I understand that sometimes people don't want to wait, but I'm not usually in that position.)

I am looking for a specific costume right now, and the one I want, in my size, was posted not long ago (and still hasn't sold, to my knowledge). But it's posted for about the same price as what I could pay for it from Dahlal. The poster claims she paid almost $100 more in shipping, and that may be true, because of her location. But her location is not my problem. Unless I could get it for a fair amount less than it would cost me to buy new, then I'd rather buy directly from Dahlal, with whom I've dealt before and know to be helpful and reputable.

I do understand that sometimes people have fallen in love with a particular style that is no longer available. There's one dress I wish I'd bought when I had the chance, and I'm kicking myself for passing it up. However, I still wouldn't buy it used for the same or more than what the new price was.

To me, a used item is worth, at best, 75% of the original price, if it is in like-new condition. If not, then it is not worth more than 50% of the original cost.

I think that is a great attitude to take going into the swap section, and I try to remind myself of that constantly, but sometimes the perfect costume just catches you- That caramel abla I bought a year or so ago is a *perfect* fit in my colors & I haven't seen anything *exactly* like it in a while. Sure, I could find something similar, but I wanted *that* one & no other would do.
Sigh- I am such a bad shopper!

I do wish folks would be more upfront with their care tho- most of what I have purchased has been well worth what I paid, even the ones that needed major TLC, but I have also learned the hard way that well loved does NOT always translate to well cared for ,m::

Keep in mind that uncommon sizes and unusual color combinations will not sell as quickly as something more standard.

I don't have a problem paying full price for something brand new-especially a Bella.

It kills me when someone says something is "new, only worn twice". New is new-NEVER worn.

Originally Posted by CalgaryBibi

... I am looking for a specific costume right now, and the one I want, in my size, was posted not long ago (and still hasn't sold, to my knowledge). But it's posted for about the same price as what I could pay for it from Dahlal. The poster claims she paid almost $100 more in shipping, and that may be true, because of her location. But her location is not my problem. Unless I could get it for a fair amount less than it would cost me to buy new, then I'd rather buy directly from Dahlal, with whom I've dealt before and know to be helpful and reputable. ...

I saw the same thing with a costume that a seller bought used from the swapmeet. She had it professionally altered, however the costume still did not work for her. She said that she was adding the extra money to recoup the alteration costs, so the costume ended up costing more than the original selling price. Beautiful costume but I'm not prepared to absorb that kind of additional cost.

If you buy a 150.00 fixer or basic costume, and add 150.00 worth of time, bling, and repair to it would you really sell it for less than the initial price you paid? That doesn't make any sense. I have sold costumes for more than the purchase price I paid, even after wearing a few times (so it's no longer new) just because I take care of my costumes; I reinforce where needed add loads of bling, rework poor or mis-design elements, and basically make them a lot better than what I initially paid for. If people don't approve they don't have to buy it, but that doesn't make it unethical to sell it for what you think it's worth. I value my efforts, and other people must as well because they buy them.

eta: I certainly wouldn't advertise them as unworn or undanced in if they weren't, that would be a no-no.

But restyling and adding more bling is different than an alteration. An alteration, in most cases, doesn't add any value to the costume except for the person for whom it was altered. Adding bling, etc., is different, and I can see where that might add value (although I'd still take into consideration that it's used). When something is used, I don't expect to pay full price or to be responsible for the seller recouping all her expenses.

That said, there are certain discontinued items that might command a higher than normal "used" price, because they're hard to get. I'm thinking of, say, "The Tribal Bible."

But, in most cases, used is used, and used does not have the same value as new. Of course, it's all relative, and an item is worth what the "market" is willing to pay for it. If someone wants to sell an item for the original price plus her shipping and alteration costs, more power to her, if she can find a buyer. I'm saying that I probably won't be that buyer, and I don't feel any obligation whatsoever to cover someone else's original shipping/alteration costs, especially when I can still order that item directly, myself and not incur those extra costs.

Originally Posted by CalgaryBibi

But restyling and adding more bling is different than an alteration. An alteration, in most cases, doesn't add any value to the costume except for the person for whom it was altered. Adding bling, etc., is different, and I can see where that might add value (although I'd still take into consideration that it's used). When something is used, I don't expect to pay full price or to be responsible for the seller recouping all her expenses.

That said, there are certain discontinued items that might command a higher than normal "used" price, because they're hard to get. I'm thinking of, say, "The Tribal Bible."

But, in most cases, used is used, and used does not have the same value as new. Of course, it's all relative, and an item is worth what the "market" is willing to pay for it. If someone wants to sell an item for the original price plus her shipping and alteration costs, more power to her, if she can find a buyer. I'm saying that I probably won't be that buyer, and I don't feel any obligation whatsoever to cover someone else's original shipping/alteration costs, especially when I can still order that item directly, myself and not incur those extra costs.

Exactly. Plus, I'm always thinking about other people's sweat on top of other people's sweat...

As for the "well loved" terminology, I've always assumed that the dancer wore it and wore it and wore it and wore it and it's going to have visible signs of wear and tear.

I actually think that bellydancestore changed everything with the sheer inventory they provide. I was around too in the swapmeet's hayday, when buying new still meant (for me) waiting for Rakkasah or trying to find something in-stock at Dahlal or taking your chances with a custom order. So that's why my attitude has changed. No more buying because of possible re-sale value, and buying strictly because I just want it. ..l;,

Originally Posted by CalgaryBibi

But restyling and adding more bling is different than an alteration. An alteration, in most cases, doesn't add any value to the costume except for the person for whom it was altered. Adding bling, etc., is different, and I can see where that might add value (although I'd still take into consideration that it's used). When something is used, I don't expect to pay full price or to be responsible for the seller recouping all her expenses.

That said, there are certain discontinued items that might command a higher than normal "used" price, because they're hard to get. I'm thinking of, say, "The Tribal Bible."

But, in most cases, used is used, and used does not have the same value as new. Of course, it's all relative, and an item is worth what the "market" is willing to pay for it. If someone wants to sell an item for the original price plus her shipping and alteration costs, more power to her, if she can find a buyer. I'm saying that I probably won't be that buyer, and I don't feel any obligation whatsoever to cover someone else's original shipping/alteration costs, especially when I can still order that item directly, myself and not incur those extra costs.

Exactly. The costume was altered so that it could fit her. There wasn't any bling added to it, so it did not increase in value. Changes would have to be made to the alterations to return it to its' original measurements. That means spending more time, effort and money. I would just go for something new instead.

I think that used costumes should be bought and sold like cars or other items of high value, but not like homes. Personally, I think it is wrong to sell a costume for more than you paid for it, with the exception of those who invest in lots of extra work (like refurbs or adding lots of bling).

I saw a costume I sold for $75 on the swap meet for $150 and it was a well-worn costume in what I considered bad shape. I was appalled. However, when talking to others about it, they sort of shrugged and said she had a right to sell it for whatever she wants. It's a free-market after all. Of course, I've always disliked capitalism in my own hippie way.

The way I look at it is...we're among friends here (mostly) and some say bhuz is like their extended family. Would you sell a costume to your best friend for more than you paid for it? I know I wouldn't.

So FWIW, I think I might write an article on costume selling etiquette and tips...

Originally Posted by andalee-oriental

I think that used costumes should be bought and sold like cars or other items of high value, but not like homes. Personally, I think it is wrong to sell a costume for more than you paid for it, with the exception of those who invest in lots of extra work (like refurbs or adding lots of bling).

I saw a costume I sold for $75 on the swap meet for $150 and it was a well-worn costume in what I considered bad shape. I was appalled. However, when talking to others about it, they sort of shrugged and said she had a right to sell it for whatever she wants. It's a free-market after all. Of course, I've always disliked capitalism in my own hippie way.

The way I look at it is...we're among friends here (mostly) and some say bhuz is like their extended family. Would you sell a costume to your best friend for more than you paid for it? I know I wouldn't.

So FWIW, I think I might write an article on costume selling etiquette and tips...

In general, I agree with you- but just playing devils advocate... what if you buy a costume for less than it is worth, and then need to swap it for some reason (you lose/gain weight, you realize it's not your color and you look like a vampire in it, you need something with more coverage, etc) It would be great if you could just swap across the board & get something of equal value, but if you are trying to find a different size, most likely the people who want your original size aren't going to have the size you are looking for. In a case like that (let's say the costume is in impeccable condition & well made just for the sake of comparison) why would it be unethical to sell it for replacement value?

I still think a lot of people get into a financial bind thinking of costumes as an investment rather than consumable goods. It's a bit like buying an antique for the investment value, and then using it every day and expecting it to increase in value. Or maybe buying a rare stamp & then licking the back & mailing it to grandma. I run into this at my work- selling baby stuff on consignment- some people are SO shocked that I price their $300 crib set at $50. Had someone last week huff out to take her items "where respectable people will appreciate it's true value." I wish her the best of luck, I really do. This is simply not the market where people will pay more than the sticker price for something used.

I also see an interesting component to the mix and that is - who is selling the costume.
I see more well known Bhuzzers (in terms of national fame or Bhuz fame) selling costumes for higher prices and getting that $$.
I know an initial thought would be - well she is famous so her costumes are more expensive. Well, not always.
Some people's costumes sell better just by the shear fact of who they are.
I have actually considered asking one of them to post a costume of mine for sale....just to see if it sells faster under there name (more Bhuz known) than mine....
Just a thought

So what about Ebay then? There was a time that a $500 used bella would get $800, because there could be a bid war. Bella was not so easy to get a while back. I used to consider putting my bellas on ebay because I knew I could get way more than I paid, but I just couldn't let them go, and I knew if I sold them on Bhuz I had a good chance of getting them back.

Originally Posted by annwyn

I knew if I sold them on Bhuz I had a good chance of getting them back.

& that right there is a good reason for pricing fairly! I swapped a green costume recently (locally, not on bhuz) and am already wondering if the dancer would let me buy back my work! I haven't worn it in ages, but that emotional attachment, I tell you!

On the other hand, it is still a fairly small global bellydance market- one of my friends has noticed things she made & sold years ago, far from Alaska, gradually being brought back up in forums she knows, or, in one case, physically brought back to Alaska by a dancer moving up from Florida. Cycle those babies through, ladies! (& please take care of them! neglected beauties make me so sad!)

I think in general yes, costume values decline with wear and tear. But it really depends on the quality of the costume. When I first started dancing I bought used costumes off of other dancers or made my own. Eventually, I decided to have all my costumes customed designed by 2 local dancers who specialized in costuming. Now, these were top of the line costumes that cost anywhere from a base price of $1200 on up. I've sold the majority of these costumes for close to what I paid for them even though I wore them often and frequently. Why? They were very well made high quality costumes that could stand up to the rigors of dancing. In some of my higher end costumes you would be hard put to re-create today as the cost of material has gone up. When you start adding up the cost of swarvoski crystal, rhinestones, sequined fabric, fringe etc, I often spent more money on my costume supplies then a new "cookie cutter" costume costs today.

Originally Posted by Margaret

So do dancers who purchase high-end cossies pay the high prices because they feel they're guaranteed to recoup its costs after using it for a few months?

yes. as long as the economy is good. then if you buy a name brand costume you will usually do well in selling it. or trading it.

I don't feel that the costume should lose alot of value unless there is were and tear. but most high end costumes can take alot of wear. i am surprised when people are selling a bella after wearing it once for 5 min. if you are dancing for 5 min your are not most likely not getting paid. so why would you buy a $700.00 dollar costume? and then sell it for less. i can't even build up a sweat in 5 min.
then i see some people selling bella's for over $800.00 i have really nice new bellas and have never paid more then $750.00 And these i use at Weddings and private parties. some resturants but it depends on where i am dancing. I think some alterations are fine to make with out changing the price to much. cause i know which dancers are the same size as me and i know when i get it i usually will not have to fix anything on it and can go out and wear it.
Some things i mark way down an to pay bill's but it is worth more. if it started out as more and at the time i had to lower the price to sell i would not have a problem with some one selling it for what it is worth later on. i think we all have different ideas of what the value of things are. if you want it for that price buy it if not don't. I think it is a good idea to find people on bhuz that are the same size as you and like the same style so you can trade or buy from each other. then you know things fit.

I like the car analogy - it seems very fitting