Thread: the jump

well,after a week of workshops with aziza in duisburg, it was back to reality.

and that was a very cold shower this time...

so, at the moment i feel closer than ever to "the jump"...

with some encouragmenet from others i know do believe that dancing full time would take care of my bills/daily life expenses without even loosing to much of my current life style. i have a lot of students, workshop work is starting to come in, i dont perform that much, but if i wanted to i do have some knew connections for restaurant work in brussels, and i've never really tried to get onto entertainment companies books. and mostly teaching, if i add a couple of classes to my current schedule, i should be fine income wise. both before and after taxes.

BUT
what SCARES the hell out of me though is my social security. in belgium, when you are an employee, regardless with what company, your social security (health insurance, pension, sick leave benefits, unemployment benefits etc et) are VERYgood, among the best in the world. when you are selfemployed ... not soo good (and my boyfriend is self employed so i witness this first hand. tootache, dentist bills, not so good, little operation meant lost a week of income this week)... . mostly health insurance and pension scare me so much. freaks my family out too, and i do take their advice to heart.


dont know if i want any advice really, just wanted to share.

what made you decide to take the jump? how do you deal with the insecurity? what are your "arrangements" for things like falling ill and old age? just a good pension fund ? housing prices are hell here too btw, i know that is different in the US, but even worse in the UK.

Artemisia

Artemisia, I don't blame you for being nervous about losing your benefits. I made the decision long ago to stay with my day job and do my dancing on the side. There are pros and cons to both approaches. Having that regular income, plus benefits, meant that I could make some business decisions based on artistic desires rather than the bottom line. It also meant that I had to miss out on some dance experiences. I'd be interested in hearing other dancers' experiences too.

hey,

yes, i recognize that, i do like being able to spend my dance money how i want it (on dance, not on rent) and to be able to say no to gigs that dont sound like they'd be any fun. the few dance friends i know that have dance as their fulltime income do a lot of ****ty dance jobs to make rent. i never have had to.

on the other hand, right now, i just feel like giving it a go you know. and to be able to get to that next level i want to get i just NEED more time, daytime time to work on my skills. there is too much stuff i need to say no to at the moment, and i am also exhausted and frustrated. but funny enough, now deciding to go full time makes me feel i wasted 6 years pretending to be an academic. with no phd to show for. i keep telling myself 'just another half year, just finish the damn thing', but then these fantastic dance opportunities come up (south africa, the big gig, etc) and i cannot say no to them.

well, i'm stuck in my job (which most of the time i do LIKE) for at least another year. i do have decided to register as self employed in the new year and to actually finally starting to get paid. in my mind in needed to make the swith to this being a "paid" job. i have been treating it as "work" and professionally organised for years already, but treating it as an "income" is new for me. so far all dance money went back to dance. so i'll see where that gets me. it's a new frame of mind.

Artemesia,

Go for it! YOu seem to have had a lot of successes of late, so give it a whirl. This doesn't have to be a 'forever' step - you can always go back to a better-paying job or consult on occasion. While you're still at your current job, try to save as much as possible for your nest-egg. I'm in the same boat - I left a full time job and became a bellydance teacher. I saved my superannuation and redundancy payout and think of them as my untouchable retirement fund - I try to invest wisely and not spend these funds. And I have to be realistic about owning a house - not possible without a rich husband or going back to full time work (prices are rediculous here, too).

I've found that my cost of living has come down. I really only work part time (though setting up the business was closer to full time), so I have time to seek out cheaper shopping, and sit in a coffee shop with a library book, or go to the movies at cheaper, off-peak times. I therefore don't have to spend much on consumption or on entertainment. Plus many of my living expenses (such as rent, exercise clothes) are tax deductable. I'm less stressed, so spend less on pricey overseas holidays - I no longer feel the need to flee the country cos work is driving me nuts!

I've also discovered that some gigs (eg: hen's & kid's parties) can be quite lucrative, and often pay cash, so you can target these to build up funds for your holidays. I'm sure you'll make it all work for you.

If it's of any help, I wrote an article about my first year of building up business (difficult, but ultimately worth it!). It's called 'My Year of Living Shimmily' and it's here: Jewel Bellydance - Belly dance classes melbourne Australia ::: Articles .

Not sure but could you get supplimental insurance to cover dental, hospital stay etc?
As far as pensions, retirement plans as a full time dancer...haha. I call it being on the Freedom 95 plan. I'll be workin and dancing til I can't stand anymore. ;)

well, you said you don't know if you want advice so i will tell you what i did and perhaps that will work for you too.

i did finish my degree while dancing 4 nights per week pro. then spent a number of years dancing pro full time. those were some of the best years of my life and i am very happy i did it.

i did return to a civilian day job for many reasons, including responsibility to other people. but i am very glad i "made the jump" and sustained it as long as i did.

if you can force yourself to finish your degree, you will probably have more of a sense of security about your future, knowing you can get a job with benefits should you need to. that will help you fully enjoy your time as a pro dancer. that way you can be practical and will never regret not finishing the degree, and at the same time you can follow your dreams with a back up plan.

if you can do it, i say go for it. make it happen. you only live once [as far as i know] but i would finish the degree, then dance as a reward for finishing the degree.

I still have my part-time day job and will keep it because I refuse to teach regular weekly classes. For some reason, the thought of being tied down by these courses just freaks me out. Psychologists, feel free to analyze me ..l;,

So I make a nice amount of money from teaching workshops and doing some dance gigs but not enough to make a full living from it.
And I also want to dance because I want to, not because I have to.

Anyway, in your situation, I think you could really give it a try. I mean, if after 2 years you feel that it's not what you want, you can still go back to working in a "normal" job, after all, you are a clever, well-educated girl!

Good luck anyways

MEISSOUN

Originally Posted by artemisia_danst

hey,

makes me feel i wasted 6 years pretending to be an academic. with no phd to show for. i keep telling myself 'just another half year, just finish the damn thing', but then these fantastic dance opportunities come up (south africa, the big gig, etc) and i cannot say no to them.
k

I would totally recommend finishing the Ph.D. for mental health reasons. As a promoter, if someone can't come to me one year, then I have them the next year. You could take 6 months to do this..p::

well, i'm working at a research centre at the moment, and supposedly finishing my phd off hours. so i cant take six months to finish it. i need to either start the dance business, or stay in this job. i cant do only the phd... no more funding for that.

there is no drive to finnish it cause whether i do or dont, it'll never get me a better job. i've not followed the fast track phd way, have always had another life you know, so academically i'm already half "out" as people that started with me are now on the next step of the ladder while i'm not. there are no jobs for history phds outside of university, except for very few places like the one where i work now. if i quit this, that's it for academics. (i'm not brian may ha, though i have been finding his story very inspiring). there is no going back. i could get "a" job, but it wouldnt be as well paid. phd or not. your considered out of the loop, and if people dont know you etc, and you've not published X articled per year, bye bye. taking a few years off is a nono, working part time too. it's accepted when you do it for having kids (and then even, if you dont show you are on top of things, you are out and parttime is frowned upon), but not cause you want to persue something else for a while.

i do have a degree. i have two in fact. i've spend 10 years at university. i just havent managed finishing this damn thing and i have been working on it for 6 years. i KNOW it should be long out of the way by now, but always, well, other stuff has come up that i like doing better. i just cant get my mind set on it. i keep promising myself to put more time in it, but i always find other things to do instead... and i've generally been a 9 to 5 academic, refusing to work 80H weeks like many of my colleagues...

I took the jump last October, decided to try it, or I'd regret it for ever. I don't have the time right now to post away (you know why), but I would like to talk about this sometime we get to sit together!

thanks
i've been jealous of you for months because of this :-)

Originally Posted by Queenie

I took the jump last October, decided to try it, or I'd regret it for ever. I don't have the time right now to post away (you know why), but I would like to talk about this sometime we get to sit together!

thanks, going to go read your article now!
yes, cost of living doesnt scare me that much... the insurance thing does...

i joke about dancing and teaching till i'm in my 90ties too, but you know, life/my body might decide otherwise eh...

Originally Posted by jewelbellydance

Artemesia,

Go for it! YOu seem to have had a lot of successes of late, so give it a whirl. This doesn't have to be a 'forever' step - you can always go back to a better-paying job or consult on occasion. While you're still at your current job, try to save as much as possible for your nest-egg. I'm in the same boat - I left a full time job and became a bellydance teacher. I saved my superannuation and redundancy payout and think of them as my untouchable retirement fund - I try to invest wisely and not spend these funds. And I have to be realistic about owning a house - not possible without a rich husband or going back to full time work (prices are rediculous here, too).

I've found that my cost of living has come down. I really only work part time (though setting up the business was closer to full time), so I have time to seek out cheaper shopping, and sit in a coffee shop with a library book, or go to the movies at cheaper, off-peak times. I therefore don't have to spend much on consumption or on entertainment. Plus many of my living expenses (such as rent, exercise clothes) are tax deductable. I'm less stressed, so spend less on pricey overseas holidays - I no longer feel the need to flee the country cos work is driving me nuts!

I've also discovered that some gigs (eg: hen's & kid's parties) can be quite lucrative, and often pay cash, so you can target these to build up funds for your holidays. I'm sure you'll make it all work for you.

If it's of any help, I wrote an article about my first year of building up business (difficult, but ultimately worth it!). It's called 'My Year of Living Shimmily' and it's here: Jewel Bellydance - Belly dance classes melbourne Australia ::: Articles .

i have 12 more months to go on my contract (runs till dec 2008) and sometime in summer they will want me to decide wheter or not i sign a renewal (another two years). so that gives me about 8 months to decide :-)

I haven't read the whole thread yet, and I promise to come back when I have more time, Artemisia.

But the short answer is -- you have to consider retirement plans, insurance, etc. part of your regular bills when you're self-employed and you really NEED to make more money. Maybe not in the first year or two, but you have to be certain the potential is there. Because you're really not replacing your income if you're not able to also provide yourself with some basic security.

LOL -- I should take my own advice on that one!

More later...

i'm in the US and just flying by the seat of my pants. I don't have health insurance, pension, by the time i'm old social security will be a thing of the past. i'm not yet 30 tho and i really dont' worry about it much. i'll just save up and move to a 3rd world country in my old age and live like a queen.
not really, i know that's not very likely. i guess i'm just not worrying about it now. it's more important to do what i like right now.

I know several full time dancers and though they don't have trouble with making ends meet, they worry a lot about getting their classes full. I think you need to teach app. 10 hours a week so you have a solid base, which means that you can't accept gigs on those days unless you have someone to teach the class for you. I wonder how much time you can spend on your own development as a dancer when you have to teach three to four days a week and doing all the paperwork.

On the other hand, the dancers that choose a (belly) dance career are in general much happier because they are making it on their own. And I think that they maintain a higher level because of it, in classes and in performances.

Hi Artemisia,

A practical tip I got from a teacher was to write down on beforehand for yourself what the minimum income would be that you need to 'survive' (including health care, taxes, car, rent etc) and what the expected time spent working for that would be.

Then have a look at how many hours of classes (and at what rate!) plus how many gigs a month this would take. Also check the amount of time you will spend in total, including the number of hours you will be spending on paperwork, preparation etc..

This at least gives a bit of a norm, so you can orient yourself on how much time you will want to spend working to be able to do the things you want. The ideal would be to find a balance between having time to do what you want and earning enough money to survive doing that

Making a short-term (week?)schedule also really helps with efficiently using the time you have (e.g. scheduling a few hours of classes on the same day to reduce overhead) But dont forget to schedule in some downtime for yourself and some time to work on your own material..

Having a few longer term goals written down (somewhere visible) also really help focusing on what you want to achieve.

Oh, and saving what you can while still employed is also great advice! (that I should take myself )

Hugs, Khalida

PS: like some of the other posters said before: this doesn't have to be a definitive 'jump'..
You can evaluate after a few months or terms how it goes and see how you feel..

Its always good to know that you can fall back on an education, just in case. If all else fails there are still 'interim' jobs or freelance jobs you could take to bridge gaps in between employment..

Originally Posted by mekyria

I know several full time dancers and though they don't have trouble with making ends meet, they worry a lot about getting their classes full. I think you need to teach app. 10 hours a week so you have a solid base, which means that you can't accept gigs on those days unless you have someone to teach the class for you. I wonder how much time you can spend on your own development as a dancer when you have to teach three to four days a week and doing all the paperwork.

On the other hand, it just might be that one 15 minute gig will pay you more than teaching an hour's class. Or consolidating multiple nights of classes in one location into one night, improves your profit rather than decreasing it. Dancers in business really need to be on top of their numbers, so you know where the most profit is, and you can choose to follow that. Of course, you might decide to do less profitable activities for many reasons (good will, charity, having a thriving studio leads to more gigs, your less profitable advanced classes are good for your own dance development, etc), but it's good to make your business decisions from a basis of knowledge!

Originally Posted by artemisia_danst

thanks
i've been jealous of you for months because of this :-)

Ehm, ditto! ..l;,

Let's just say the grass is always greener on the other side then eh

i know! would you mind emailing me and telling me how you have been coping? what scares me the most is social security arrangements, and VAT. ;-)