Thread: Are you territorial?

I've been wondering about this for a long time now. I live in a tiny city with very few dance opportunities (although I've been working on creating more). Until now, I've traveled to nearby cities within a 3 hour radius where my family lives to go to gigs. I don't personally hear negative opinions from other professionals, but there is one that I know who isn't necessarily happy that I do this either. My question is, are you territorial? Is this ethical?

Note: I ONLY establish gigs in these cities with new restaurants who have never had a dancer previously, I DO NOT steal gigs from other dancers, and I'll perform if I'm requested. I also charge more than the locals to prevent undercutting and to supplement my gas.

Most businesses would love to have a monopoly in their market, but in most cases that is not realistic. If one is in business, e.g. exchanging money for services, than one can be expected to explore different markets, and should expect competitors to do so as well. I don't think this is an unethical concept.

No dancer "owns" an area. I don't see anything unethical about going to another area for a job.
That being said, I am not crazy when I hear of dancers from the city coming to my tiny area. It rarely happens, and I greatly appreciate it when gigs close to me are referred to me by dancers who don't have to drive two hours to find a job.

In your situation, I think you are fine to travel. If you were leaving a large area to dance in a smaller area, I would think it wasn't really nice, but completely reasonable.

I'm not gonna lie -- I've caught myself having territorial thoughts before. But I recognize those thoughts as being immature and unprofessional, so I laugh at myself and set them aside when they come up.

Ok great! This makes me feel alot better

Originally Posted by Lauren_

I'm not gonna lie -- I've caught myself having territorial thoughts before. But I recognize those thoughts as being immature and unprofessional, so I laugh at myself and set them aside when they come up.

Lauren, thankyou for your refreshing honesty!

I think this is a slightly complex issue.

We need to be respectful and do our research when moving into new areas or venues.

There is often a fine line between an open market and blatent disrespect.

There is often no easy answer.

PS what do people consider to be commonly agreed protocol?

If you develop a new performance opportunity where there was none before - the local dancers there should not be angry at you but at themselves for not having done it themselves

Since you are not taking away existing gigs, I don't see a problem.

MEISSOUN

At one point there were four different bellydance teachers working out of one of the studios I use. I had someone else set up a class at the same time as one of mine in the same venue, just downstairs. I was a little put out by that, but what could I do?

I'm still teaching, but a lot of the people who followed me aren't...

Somewhat off topic, but there was a dance instructor in a nearby city who tried to start classes in my little town. I called her and told her that my classes were teeny-tiny and that if she came then there was a chance that neither of use would have classes of worthwhile size. She tried anyway, but didn't get any students.

If two teachers try to pull from the same little pool of potential students, then it is likely that both will fail. That's just math.

Originally Posted by Emma

At one point there were four different bellydance teachers working out of one of the studios I use. I had someone else set up a class at the same time as one of mine in the same venue, just downstairs. I was a little put out by that, but what could I do?

I'm still teaching, but a lot of the people who followed me aren't...

That is very magnanimous of you LOL.

We (our dance school) have just had someone set up in the same venue the next day, but decided to shrug it off too.. but one cant help but think a polite chat may have been nice..

I personally would not do that.

Originally Posted by Lauren_

I'm not gonna lie -- I've caught myself having territorial thoughts before. But I recognize those thoughts as being immature and unprofessional, so I laugh at myself and set them aside when they come up.

My two cents worth...I think its human nature to be territorial. Anyone remember Daffy Duck "Mine! Mine! its all mine!!!"? As long as you realise its your inner two year old who doesn't want to share and you have a safe place to vent those inner two year old thoughts when you need to, I think it's a normal reaction to a new kid in town so to speak.

Originally Posted by Viv

My two cents worth...I think its human nature to be territorial. Anyone remember Daffy Duck "Mine! Mine! its all mine!!!"? As long as you realise its your inner two year old who doesn't want to share and you have a safe place to vent those inner two year old thoughts when you need to, I think it's a normal reaction to a new kid in town so to speak.

LOL this is soooo funny I *always* talk about the 'inner two year old' (and her counterpart, the inner mommy who is supposed to keep her in check) but I've never heard anyone else say it!

And yes, this is exactly what my brushes with territorial feelings have been like. "What, why are they coming to MY town to teach... " and then "Oh, yeah... I don't actually OWN a town."

I had a harsh lesson in bellydance territory right after I returned to my hometown.

After months of unsuccessful attempts to get in contact with their previous instructor, a local group decided to seek out another dance instructor. I was asked to teach the group as an unpaid volunteer. I wasn't particularly excited about doing it, but I agreed to do it as a favor to one of the group members. I, much like her students, thought the previous teacher was out of the picture, and since there were a lot of eager students waiting to learn, I figured why not? I set up an introductory meeting, so everyone could get to know me, learn more about my teaching style, etc. Guess who showed up the night of that meeting with an entourage and was literally in tears, because I "stole" her gig?

I thought that maybe there had been some misunderstanding and gave her an opportunity to speak at this meeting. Then came the paper trail of unanswered emails and phone calls that went to her...

So, anyhow, I wound up having to speak to a building administrator about the whole situation along with the former teacher, who again, was accompanied by an entourage and continued to cry. The administrator "ruled in my favor," so to speak, which infuriated her even more.

When lessons began, guess who continued to sneak into the building where I was teaching to give lessons on the same day and at the same time as my classes, and EVEN sent in a mole to recruit students from my class?

It was amazing in the worst sense of the word. It's one of the reasons I've been reluctant to take up another teaching gig in this area.

Originally Posted by ckcalloway

I had a harsh lesson in bellydance territory right after I returned to my hometown.

After months of unsuccessful attempts to get in contact with their previous instructor, a local group decided to seek out another dance instructor. I was asked to teach the group as an unpaid volunteer. I wasn't particularly excited about doing it, but I agreed to do it as a favor to one of the group members. I, much like her students, thought the previous teacher was out of the picture, and since there were a lot of eager students waiting to learn, I figured why not? I set up an introductory meeting, so everyone could get to know me, learn more about my teaching style, etc. Guess who showed up the night of that meeting with an entourage and was literally in tears, because I "stole" her gig?

I thought that maybe there had been some misunderstanding and gave her an opportunity to speak at this meeting. Then came the paper trail of unanswered emails and phone calls that went to her...

So, anyhow, I wound up having to speak to a building administrator about the whole situation along with the former teacher, who again, was accompanied by an entourage and continued to cry. The administrator "ruled in my favor," so to speak, which infuriated her even more.

When lessons began, guess who continued to sneak into the building where I was teaching to give lessons on the same day and at the same time as my classes, and EVEN sent in a mole to recruit students from my class?

It was amazing in the worst sense of the word. It's one of the reasons I've been reluctant to take up another teaching gig in this area.

Wow that is just crazy! With teaching gigs, it's all about what's best for the students. If the old teacher was unwilling to do all the duties that come with teaching, then she should look into a less time-consuming teaching position. Besides, based on what you're telling us, she seems a little pyscho!

Originally Posted by ckcalloway

I had a harsh lesson in bellydance territory right after I returned to my hometown.

After months of unsuccessful attempts to get in contact with their previous instructor, a local group decided to seek out another dance instructor. I was asked to teach the group as an unpaid volunteer...

The administrator "ruled in my favor," so to speak, which infuriated her even more...

When lessons began, guess who continued to sneak into the building where I was teaching to give lessons on the same day and at the same time as my classes, and EVEN sent in a mole to recruit students from my class?

What a terrible experience! Why didn’t she answer any of the messages if she really wanted the teaching job? It would have been a lot easier to accept the job in the first place instead of trying to steal your students.

I’m sorry you had to deal with that! Hopefully is won’t prevent you from dancing and sharing your love of dance!

I am territorial to my area. That being said, if someone from a different dancers area calls for a gig, I refer them back to that dancer(s) and give them my price (which is higher because of gas price and time spent driving) and let them know that if it doesn't work out THEN they can call me. If they don't want to go with the other dancer for whatever reason, then I'll do it. I've lost and gained gigs that way but kept the respect of my fellow dancers. Which, to me, is far outweighing getting paid.

I guess I was lucky when I was dancing in San Francisco we had a network of dancers and we shared gigs. I think territorial-ity leads to a lot of problems but again i was in a big city and wasn't trying to make a living from it since I have akai silks

It was natural for me to refer to my teachers when I started out(to give a reference of my style and how I teach.)
There are 6 of my "concurrents"(competitors) in my town that I refer to as "good teachers" if my classes haven´t fit a students schedule.

It would have felt strange to pretend that they do not exist,and we have haflas together:-)

However there have been an incident where I became territorial:a new teacher decided to stand outside my classes "open house"handling out flyers for her classes(cost were 25% of mine)
I contacted her to kindly point out that I wasn´t feeling comfortable with that kind of behavior(also asked how she could pay her taxes?)

She was very upset and cussed at me.Haven´t heard of her since then,and this was some years ago.