Thread: Took a Stand at restaurant, AND IT WORKED!!!!!

Originally Posted by *Shira*

Maria, congratulations for taking the risk, and for achieving success!

I'll bet part of the reason for your success is that you have been selective over the years with respect to which dancers you recruit and keep on the schedule. Ie, you've chosen dancers with enough intelligence to understand the need for solidarity, and enough maturity to see that standing with the group would benefit them more than trying to push an individual agenda.

Absolutely, I am picky. I have picked dancers with brains. I have no patience for ignorance. (And I don't mean college educated, degreed, although most of them have degrees)
Also, and here is another key.
I Am Fair!
I DO NOT take every single weekend night.
I give my girls nights they ask for, and give them as much as I can.
I treat them fairly with regards to time on the schedule and stick up for them when things went sour.
So, because I am fair and stick up for them, they see that I have everyone's best interests at heart.

Originally Posted by joanneraks

Good to hear this, Maria! I second what Shira said. So, were you nervous in the meantime? Or just ticked? ;)

It was very hard, because it is my only regular gig. But, I was willing to walk away.

Originally Posted by Taj

Brass Cymbals Award!

I second the nomination!!! Maria, can you give it to yourself?? ..g.:

I am very proud of you and the other dancers who decided to fight for what is right. Heck, all you were asking for was to get paid w/o waiting around. Is THAT too much to ask? NO.

Why do places do that anyway? And how often do they try to give you something different than what you asked for? That has happened to me--they hand me $50 when they told me I was getting $60, etc. I just say, "XX told me the rate was $60, not $50." Then they happen to "remember" and cough p the $10. TEN BUCKS. Sheesh.

Maria, that's so key. it sucks when one or two people bogart the gig for themselves. I believe in karma and you obviously put good things out there so good things came back!

kudos! something similar happened here.........

in the spring i quit a location that was beautiful but paid lousy.....i quit partly cuz of pay, but also cuz during an audition, they hired a pretty beginner over 2 experienced, better dancers, AND when selecting dancers, i suggested subs and snottily answered 'can't you use the current ones?), refused to raise rates despite MANY discussions, rates raising in other venues, and trying to keep GOOD dancers with crappy pay, and the last straw was a VERY condescending snotty email from one of the owners stating 'this is my place...."............

recently, their favorite left for the same reasons.........they recently almost lost every good dancer they had(both over rates and ANOTHER snotty email from the same owner) and quickly, desparately changed their tune and doubled the rate....still not competitive yet, but ALOT closer.....that only leaves one local problem venue paying poorly............

keep trying ladies

p.s. they haven't begged me back, but that's okay, i'm glad they're doing the right thing cuz i like the venue and still support it as long as they continue on the right path

Way to go, Maria, not only to you but to the other dancers in your community.

It's great to see a community of dancers have the courage and the foresight to stand together rather than looking to see where they can capitalize on each other's misfortunes. Great work, ladies.

Your story gives me hope! Way to stick together! Good for you guys!!!

Originally Posted by aazura

I second the nomination!!! Maria, can you give it to yourself?? ..g.:

LOL! I cannot give myself the brass cymbals award, as I am already a judge.
I will just nominate myself as an example!

Originally Posted by zahena

Maria, that's so key. it sucks when one or two people bogart the gig for themselves. I believe in karma and you obviously put good things out there so good things came back!

there is a restaurant here where the gigs are bogarted. Is that a word? It's been that way at that particular restaurant for 20 years, I have heard.

I don't do that.
Not interested. The restaurant will get sick of you too. Always leave people wanting more.
Always have customers call up and say,
'We want to see x dancer, oh, she'll be in next week, we'll come then"
Less is more people!

BTW: I just bumped into my friend at Costco, just 20 min. ago, my friend who owns the dance studio where I teach. She just told me her daughter, who is 18, who took bd with me for a year, is now waitressing there.

She told me her daughter was told by tunisian waitress to watch owner because HE DOES NOT PAY the staff.

I just told my friend, that is true, I was not going to lie to her. told her the story, and now she is nervous.
I said, the first time he doesn't pay her, she needs to walk.

anyway, her hubby will be 50 this saturday, and I'll be there after a month of taking off, because I was so pissed, and they will be there, their daughter will be working, I'll be dancing, so it should be way fun. I also think they need to come to kind of, nicely, let him know that their daughter needs to be paid.

It's unreal. I cannot believe he is still not paying staff. SHEESH.

He does not keep staff, save for a few, more than 2 weeks.

It's sad, really.

Owner knows that i know ALOT of people in dance community and community per se, due to my work as event manager. I have good relations with press, businesses, dancers, etc.
Me leaving and not coming back would be mondo bad!

THis is fantastic. You are a heroine to us all!

Originally Posted by zahena

Maria, that's so key. it sucks when one or two people bogart the gig for themselves. I believe in karma and you obviously put good things out there so good things came back!

What constitutes *bogarting* a gig?

bogarting a gig is taking every single weekend, fri and sat and giving people only call in days during the week.
that's what I consider bogarting.

excellent!
you're fantastic, Maria!

I'm just sorry I didn't do it sooner, and it took me that long to get completely fed up.

But, I didn't do it sooner....so no use saying woulda coulda shoulda.

I just hope other communities are able to rally together too.
We really need not to put up with crap that no one in their right mind would put up with with a "normal" job.

Originally Posted by *maria*

bogarting a gig is taking every single weekend, fri and sat and giving people only call in days during the week.
that's what I consider bogarting.

I think some people feel that dancers are keeping other dancers out of gigs when that's not necessarily the case. The owners and managers of the places where I've worked have always had a say in who worked in their establishment and what shows could be assigned to dancers.

We have a seniority system whereby the most senior dancers are awarded the prime time shows first. New dancers in the rotation must work up from weeknights and fill-in spots to more Fridays and Saturdays. The system whereby shows are doled out is fair - I also take into consideration who's trying to make their living from dance and who has a day job. The dancers with no day job get called in to sub more often.

Is it bogarting a gig if you negotiated it and want to keep it within a group of dancers you trust? Or if there are dancers who may want to dance there, but the management does not like them for one reason or another - is it bogarting to not give them shows? I don't think so.

Hmmm, good questions THTX. There are dancers I have kept off the schedule who have asked me because the management does not like them, and I know they are troublemakers who have caused trouble at other restaurants.
I don't care whether I like them personally or not, as long as they are good dancers, the management likes them, and they are not troublemakers they are welcome on the schedule. However, I can only hire so many dancers, because I need to be fair to the ones that are there! I cannot have us all do one saturday or friday every other month because theres a zillion dancers.
Right now, we are full.
There are 6 regular dancers, and most of us get 2 weekend nights a month, some only do one.
then during the week, he calls whoever can come in. I used to book us during the week,
ex: I had every sunday, but we ended up cancelling other things for the once in a blue moon we were called.
so now I just have him call a dancer if he needs one. He is NOT organized, which is another problem.
Now, there's a dancer who wants to call in every thursday cause she works up the block and ends at 6 on thursdays, so I say, fine, go for it.
She may go in once a month.

Originally Posted by *maria*

Hmmm, good questions THTX. There are dancers I have kept off the schedule who have asked me because the management does not like them, and I know they are troublemakers who have caused trouble at other restaurants. I don't care whether I like them personally or not, as long as they are good dancers, the management likes them, and they are not troublemakers they are welcome on the schedule. ....

Great points Maria and Tamra Henna. It's their money, they get to hire their choice of dancers.
They all have their preferences for who is right for their restaurant. Some places seem to want to have lots of variety. Some want to have only their personal favorites for whatever reason. When scheduling a restaurant I ask the owner who they prefer on which days and base the schedule on that along with dancer availability of course. It should have little to nothing to do with the scheduling dancer.
Some dancers prefer to play politics with it, unfortunately. Some owners are so busy with running a restaurant they don't notice or don't care, unless a political dancer's choices end up effecting his restaurant. I've seen owners take back the scheduling from these sorts of dancers in those cases.

Originally Posted by *maria*

He is NOT organized, which is another problem.

OMG! SO common. The venues around here where the owner(s) make the schedule end up running into problems with multiple dancer's showing up etc. Not fun.
The benefit in having a dancer do the schedule is that she is usually more motivated to keep it organized.
Having an owner doing the schedule however is better than having it done by a dancer who has her own personal agenda. Luckily those dancers are few and far between.

Originally Posted by *maria*

That is they key, the community has to stand together.

You're right - standing together is the key! It's unfortunate that's not the case for most places. The lead dancer quits and the mob of belly dancers usually knock each other over trying to get the job - and that usually leaves the owner in Nirvana - "I hear 50, 50, 50, do I hear 40, I got a 40, can I get a 30....a 30 going once, twice...15! Sold to the belly dancer that will dance for $15"

Trying to rally the troupes is usually a very difficult job! Congrats on making it work!

"We're not worthy, we're not worthy"

Originally Posted by *maria*

bogarting a gig is taking every single weekend, fri and sat and giving people only call in days during the week.
that's what I consider bogarting.

good points on seniority, etc., but there HAVE been occasions where dancers have nailed a location as 'house' dancer, not allowing others to come in.....even waving the community at large saying 'this is my gig'.....

now if the owner wants one 'house' dancer and is public about it, fine,they're entitled to..... others work with one or two merely as a net, until business builds and they feel comfortable and 'safe' enuf to bring in new ones.........thats smart!

but there ARE dancers 'bogarting' either out of greed, or to feed low self-esteem, and yes, i agree with a previous post........karma will win out....but before people make judgement on those, it pays to get facts before calling a house dancer or perceived 'bogart' out....it may not be as it seems

Originally Posted by Amaryllis

You're right - standing together is the key! It's unfortunate that's not the case for most places. The lead dancer quits and the mob of belly dancers usually knock each other over trying to get the job - and that usually leaves the owner in Nirvana - "I hear 50, 50, 50, do I hear 40, I got a 40, can I get a 30....a 30 going once, twice...15! Sold to the belly dancer that will dance for $15"

Trying to rally the troupes is usually a very difficult job! Congrats on making it work!

"We're not worthy, we're not worthy"

"what she said" haha!

TamraHenna and Maria make some good points...

I think the key about "bogarting" isn't whether a particular restaurant gig is open/available to every little miss sparkley pants who feels entitled to shake her hip fringe...it's about whether the dancer leading the gig (by being the first one in, doing the schedule, whatever) is fair in her practices and reasonably responsive to what is best for the business and what the owner wants rather using her position to just build her own little fiefdom (by taking every weekend night and only using the others for fill-in when that's not what the owner asked for, by deliberately only hiring less-skilled dancers to be sure she's always the "top" dancer, by bad-mouthing other dancers to the owner without true cause, etc.)

The truth of it is...some owners *do* want a house dancer...or a very small stable of dancers (rather than the cast of 100s). And you do need to consider, when the dancers who work in the place are counting on the income (as opposed to everyone just doing it for a "fun side job") that you're able to at least offer a couple nights a month. Spreading the nights too thin, while it might be nice for the women who'd like to get the job, isn't fair to the skilled, dedicated dancers who are already working there. Unfortunately, part of breaking into the restaurant biz is timing...and sometimes part of that is just luck.

Originally Posted by aamel_MirahAmmal

...it's about whether the dancer leading the gig (by being the first one in, doing the schedule, whatever) is fair in her practices and reasonably responsive to what is best for the business and what the owner wants rather using her position to just build her own little fiefdom ... by deliberately only hiring less-skilled dancers to be sure she's always the "top" dancer, by bad-mouthing other dancers to the owner without true cause, etc.)

That happens where you are, too? I was amazed when I saw it happening here. I don't know what these people are thinking.

...it's about whether the dancer leading the gig (by being the first one in, doing the schedule, whatever) is fair in her practices and reasonably responsive to what is best for the business and what the owner wants rather using her position to just build her own little fiefdom ... by deliberately only hiring less-skilled dancers to be sure she's always the "top" dancer, by bad-mouthing other dancers to the owner without true cause, etc.)

...or by limiting the 'stable' to dancers from one school........and it's NOT new.....back home, in the early 90's when i was peeking into going pro, i noticed the area venues were stuffed with dancers from one studio...one of whom i knew personally and had danced, oh, maybe a year..........now i don't initially fault the original teacher, as she was well known, quite sweet and generous (recently passed this year) so i won't besmirch her.....it was mostly her acolytes...unless you were from that studio, you werent even looked at....that 1 year wonder acquaintance went so far as to tell my dance mommy that she doesn't study there anymore (quit after only a month) because her style wasn't 'commercial'.....to someone who had been dancing professionally for decades AND forwarded the successful career of a protege (who, ironically was dancing in the same club as miss one-year-shapoopie-sparkle-hips)...

unfortunately, neither new, nor limited to a community..........as long as there are egos, it's there to contend with.....however, with continued perseverence from the rest of the community, it's one of those karma things that'll prevail eventually.........the owners figure it out eventually and jettison the wenches