Thread: Would it be tacky.....

to send out postcards with my photo/info to area restaurants that I know have dancing already? I don't always have the time to go visit each place personally, or to call and try to get the owner or head dancer to talk to me. I figure this way they can contact me if they are interested. Any advice?

depends on the vibe of your dance community. if you did that in seattle you'd get totally blacklisted, no matter how innocent your intentions! take the time to find out who dances there and talk to one of the performers to get the scoop.

there are so many negative scenarios that could arise. the owner could call you up, offer you X to dance, and you accept. then you find out that another dancer had worked there for 2 years and was getting paid a little bit more than X and you got her fired from her job. that dancer could tell all of her dancer colleagues and bam, you have a really bad reputation as a gig theif and undercutter. or not as bad but still leaving you a mess to untangle - the owner hands the lead dancer your postcard. she looks at it and thinks 'who does she think SHE is?' and never bothers to look you up - whereas if you had called the restaurant (or, better, had dinner there on a night they had dancing), got the number of a dancer there, and had a nice chat with her, she might have been glad to take you on if they had an opening.

gigs come and go, but your reputation sticks with you for as long as you live and dance in your town! (sorry to sound so alarmist, but gig politics are pretty strict around here :) ).

I agree, it is better to get your own gigs or to wait until owners or dancers approach you and ask you for example for replacement.

Thanks for the advice gals. How sad that we can't even market our services without fear of a backlash from the rest of the community! I hate politics... Blech! I don't have the time or money to be eating out at all these different places.

Try to dance parties and weddings first. If you offer your services to clubowners you are mostly on the wrong end of the negotiation table. They might think you are out of work and try to underpay you or think you are probably not that good.

good luck

Originally Posted by stardancer

to send out postcards with my photo/info to area restaurants that I know have dancing already? I don't always have the time to go visit each place personally, or to call and try to get the owner or head dancer to talk to me. I figure this way they can contact me if they are interested. Any advice?

Yeeeeaaaahhh...I have to say I'm pretty much in line with the others here. At worst this is a somewhat tacky and potentially destructive approach and at best, it's just not very effective. Cards like these that are just mailed or dropped off without any conversation or personal touch often end up on the owners desk under a bunch of restaurant equipment catalogues or, more often, in the trash can.

Now this is just my $.02 so take with a grain of salt, but...as far as the restaurants...if the place already has dancing, I would say you should be sure to express your interest to the lead dancer--even if you stop in on your own to drop off a card and say hello to the owner in person, at least contact the lead dancer, let her know what you're doing and that of course you understand that she's responsible for scheduling the dancers blah blah blah but that if either they are in need of additional dancers or initially looking for someone for a sub list or something that you would be interested in auditioning (or whatever the process is at that place....). You might mention to the owner that you also will (or have) called the dancer to mention your interest. This helps avoid the situation where the owner plays you against the existing dancers (for cheaper...) and if done well may help avoid hard feelings to some extent because you've been above board, but it also alows you to meet both people who will/may affect the decision. If the restaurant does NOT have dancing...go in and talk directly to the owner and take your cards as something to leave behind. But seriously, do it in person. I understand that time is a premium, and I understand that it's really hard to make the time, but if you don't have the time to make the personal contact to get a job...well...do you really have the time to be a restaurant dancer? If you don't have time to approach 15 different restaurants, pick one or two that you think are your best options initially...then a little later approach one or two more...and so on. Better slow and steady and in person than to mail out postcards and twirk people off or waste your printing $$ on something that just lands in the garbage.

Again, just my crazy ravings, so take 'em or leave 'em. ,r:;

Originally Posted by stardancer

Thanks for the advice gals. How sad that we can't even market our services without fear of a backlash from the rest of the community! I hate politics... Blech! I don't have the time or money to be eating out at all these different places.

A thought on this...could you ever stop in, say, mid-afternoon (even on a weekend) and just have maybe an appetizer and a drink so it's more like a snack time? At least then you aren't spending so much money. Or (depending if/where you work during the day) for lunch? You can often get away with doing something much lighter for lunch too. If you know the owner's name, you could potentially call and try to find out when would be a good time to bring something by/when he would be there, then go and talk to him. May also be better because he may be less busy than if you try to catch him during a dinner rush.

Another option...if the place serves alcohol (and if you drink alcohol) just go in for a glass of wine after the dinner hour some night. Or even a coffee or a tea. But go at an off-peak time.

It would also be a good idea to start by networking first with the other dancers in your area. Emailing and message boards are free, and if you build a relationship the individual who schedules the dancers, you have an advocate when it comes time to audition.

Stardancer, if you don't have the time to stop in and meet anybody personally, then why should they pay any attention to you? Seriously - if you don't think getting a job there is important enough to show your face, then you must not want it very badly.

If you're serious about wanting restaurant work, then make it a point to find out who the lead dancer is at each place that interests you. Try to start conversations with her at dance events or network with her in other ways. Approach her with an inquiry asking if you could be considered as a substitute at first. If she happens to be at an event where you'll be performing, invite her to watch your performance and give you feedback on what it would take for you to be a candidate to be added to the roster of her restaurant.

Or go there when the head dancer is dancing...have a drink, be supportive and tip her! And yeah, pretty much what everybody else said. Also, who knows, you might not even like the place.

Originally Posted by amiraates

Try to dance parties and weddings first. If you offer your services to clubowners you are mostly on the wrong end of the negotiation table. They might think you are out of work and try to underpay you or think you are probably not that good.

I agree 100%. Seeming too eager for work is an unintentional undercut waiting to happen.

Parties and weddings, IMO, are the way to go if you live in a supersaturated area and going through various house dancers is your only option. Private gigs give you that great feeling of getting the job on your own merit: no feelings of desperation, or not getting in because you're not part of the head dancer's clique, or fears that you'll step on the head dancer's toes or be undercut. Problem solved!

Then again, I could be biased....I am much more allergic to schmoozing than your average girl ..l;,

Regards,
Maiya

I think the postcards could be a good way to introduce yourself to retirement homes, DJs, party planners, and other potential gigs/leads.

I agree that it's not a good way to approach a restaurant, for all the reasons mentioned above.

Hi Stardancer,
It might help to think about it in another way - for a day job, would you drop off an unsolicited resume and expect to get hired? That's a reeeally long shot. You'll need to figure out a way to network.

You could actually also market yourself to the dancers themselves - offer yourself as a backup, emergency contact, available to fill in, that sort of thing. That way you can be sure you're not stepping on toes, and that you aren't unintentionally undercutting anyone.

I totally agree with Shira tho - and this applies to ANY business - randomly sending postcards with no face-to-face contact and no follow up is rather like spam. Selling yourself means selling yourself, you have to build relationships. In the marketing world, ROI on mailouts is around 1%. That means in order to get one "inquiry", you'd need to send out 100 fliers. Not really effective. Spend good quality time and effort on 10 places you want to do business, and you have a much higher chance of success.

Again, thanks so much for the advice everyone. After thinking about it more I suppose the postcards would be ineffective. I have been restaurant dancing for 8 years now. I have opened up venues as well as coming into already established venues. I am looking at a few places that are a 2+ hr drive for me. I would like to dance at these establishments only periodically as they are far away and I am already dancing three nights a week more locally. I thought it might be nice for private party possibilities if I am occasionally dancing in areas with a larger patron base. I am not worried I will undercut as I am aware of the going rate and will not dance for less. I think I may call the establishments and see if they have a head dancer in charge of auditions. Perhaps they can provide me with contact information. I can tell you however, that in my day job entertainers constantly send us their promo material. That is how I find many of the people we eventually hire.

Originally Posted by elljay

You could actually also market yourself to the dancers themselves - offer yourself as a backup, emergency contact, available to fill in, that sort of thing. That way you can be sure you're not stepping on toes, and that you aren't unintentionally undercutting anyone.

This sums it up for me. You can get into restaurants when someone needs you. If you are available on short notice and can pull a set together even in unfamiliar territory, you will likely be in demand on those nights when a dancer gets sick (or has some other conflict).

Figure out who dances at the different places and make time to go see them dance, go to haflas where they perform. If you are involved in your dance community already, you likely already know these dancers. If not, time to get involved more.

The postcards are good for the places Lauren mentioned, who wouldn't necessarily think of having a dancer.