wig/fall/hairpiece vs. perm?

[jmdruadh]

(cross-posted to tribe; sorry if you see this twice)

Hi everybody,

I noticed that anytime I see a dancer picture and think "I want to look like that", she happens to have really long, beautiful hair. Thick, wavy, waist-length hair. My own hair is longish (3-4" below shoulder), fairly straight, and fine. I can get a little body out of it with velcro rollers and/or a curling iron, but it takes FOREVER, and I am just too lazy. Usually I just blow-dry it upside down and hope for the best.

So I'm thinking of either buying a hairpiece (to make it look longer and thicker) or getting a perm (to make it look thicker and add some loose waves). I'd really like some advice:

About perms:
- has anyone here gotten a loose wavy perm, and if so, were you happy with it? I'm shooting for body and *very* loose waves, not curls.
- how often does it have to be redone?
- how much did it cost you? Are touch-ups cheaper?
- what does it look like as it grows out?
- is there anything I should know / ask the stylist?
- is the damage comparable to coloring your hair? (I colored for 7 years, and didn't mind the extra conditioning, etc.)
- can anyone recommend a good perm specialist in the Boston area (preferably Cambridge)?

I'm alternatively considering getting a hairpiece. Can anyone tell me:
- what is the most secure method for applying it? I do a lot of head rolls/tosses, and could tone those down, but I don't want to be holding my head rigid the whole time.
- about how long does it take to put on?
- can anyone recommend a particular model of hairpiece? I'm specifically looking for something:
- natural-looking
- very long (I'd like it to end somewhere between the top of the bra back and my waist)
- straight with layers or very loosely wavy (not curly)
- that moves reasonably well
- that doesn't cover my entire head (I think I'd prefer a 3/4 cap or fall, but wouldn't rule out other styles)
- that has a secure attachment method (or could be adapted to be more secure)
- under $200 if possible (although I can go higher if it's exactly what I want)
- can anyone recommend a good wig shop in the Boston area?

Any recommendations? Alternatively, if you happen to have one for sale (dark brown, in good condition), I could take it off your hands...

[AngelaDiCaprio]

oooooooooo good question! I need more hair too....

[lilya]

Hee! You read my mind: Help me find some fake hair!

Except your post is way more eloquent than mine.... :)

[zumarrad]

As an ex hairdresser:

has anyone here gotten a loose wavy perm, and if so, were you happy with it? I'm shooting for body and *very* loose waves, not curls.

You say your hair is fine? You're going to have to have a tighter perm or you'll have nothing very quickly. It should drop and become softer, but you will not get big bouncy waves from a perm. You get that from a set, or tongs, or a combination of both.

- how often does it have to be redone?

Tricky. It depends really. You can't have it done too often or your hair will be a hideous mass of straw. Generally, the rule of thumb back in my day was perm again when the old perm has mostly grown out.

how much did it cost you? Are touch-ups cheaper

It's not a cheap process - comparable to a colour. Touch ups cheaper? Doubt it. With long hair I am guessing some hairdressers might choose to perm the roots of the top part of the hair only, as a "touch up".

what does it look like as it grows out?

Sometimes very bad, sometimes not so bad. If your perm goes well, and your hair is one-length or with very long layers, you'll have a flat top and full wavy ends that are not in the greatest of condition. The permed hair is likely to lighten as well and you may find you need to use semi-permanent colours to tone and add shine.

is there anything I should know / ask the stylist?

Get a decent consultation from a decent hairdresser who does decent work and won't lie to you. Tell him/her if you have colour in your hair, especially henna or anything that may be metallic.

is the damage comparable to coloring your hair?

Worse. This is of course why it gives you good texture, because your hair is rougher and drier due to being chemically damaged.

I have known people with long hair who had a spiral perm once every year or two, which worked well for them. I used to have one myself but I can't remember exactly how often it needed to be done. They should fill the pre-permed ends to protect them, but it can still be damaging. And I have a lot of hair that handles chemicals well, so...

Short answer? Don't do it!!! Unless you know someone with hair like yours who has had great results, and you can use the same hairdresser, just don't go there. A bad perm is something you're stuck with for months, if not years with long hair, and sometimes with the best will in the world, the perm just doesn't work out.

Hot tongs. Or a hair piece. Much less trouble.

[ssipes]

Everything Zumarrad said.

I also have fine straight hair and went through the big, long spiral perm phase in the 80's. It lightened my hair significantly, so I had to follow up with a semipermanent coor, as it grows out it produces a sharp boundary between straight and curly that is every bit as tacky IMO as dark roots on a bottle blonde. I always tried to take immaculate care of my permed hair (no brushing, very little combing, no blowdrying or curling irons, etc.)

Also, fine straight hair, after perming, does not turn into thick beautiful waves of someone who has naturally thick wavy hair. It tend to turn in to limp curls that still do not have much volume. What little volume you gain is lost at the roots (where it is neede most) as soon as your hair grows out an inch or so (so, within a month). Lots of product and pfutzing around is necessary to make it look good.

I never repermed over permed hair, so i usually had to wait a year or more between perms for it all to grow off so that I could start anew.

Lots of dancers have fine straight hair. Ultra long, it can look especially nice. Learn to like it, and buy a couple of hairpieces, that is my advice.

Sedonia

[tahiradancer]

I wear an pony tail. Not sure where there are any pictures of me in said pony tail, but I have to be honest - I like it!

This one is built on the mega claw style clip. It has three big, bouncy curls and goes to a little below my bra strap. I do a lot of head throws and it definately stays where it is supposed to!

To put it on, I do a tight french twist, pin the twist in place, then attach the claw over the twist. Very secure.

Sounds as though my hair is like yours - mid back, straight and fine. As I colour my hair, I won't perm it. My expereince is that I can do one or the other. Not both.

Buy hair! It's fun!

{{{HUGS}}}

[jmdruadh]

Hmmm... if a perm can't be "touched up" like haircolor, it is right out. Thanks for all your advice!

Now I'm focusing my efforts on picking out a hairpiece, and am *very* interested in hearing any advice anyone has on that topic.

(Not that I'm not interested in your perm stories; I have just ruled that option out for myself. Definitely share if you want!)

[Soheir_Iceland]

I´ve had spiral curls perm twice and it ruined my hair (and I have very strong hair), so I don´t recommend it. I had to cut my hair eventually to make it look good again.

I use clip in extensions. It´s easier than it looks, only takes me about 10-15 minutes to put in and it looks very natural. Here´s where I bought mine, these are great quality and human hair:

http://stores.ebay.com/WICKED-WARES-...air-Extensions

[ssipes]

I'm intrigued. Can you blend these into layered shorter hair, say just above shoulder length? Can you toss your hair around without them coming loose?

I'd love to hear from anyone else who has used this type of clip-in extension. I am growing my hair out, and have been using a synthetic 3/4 fall. I'm not very happy with it. It is hot, uncomfortable, and it tangles like crazy in my jewelry and costumes.

Sedonia

Originally Posted by soheir

I use clip in extensions. It´s easier than it looks, only takes me about 10-15 minutes to put in and it looks very natural. Here´s where I bought mine, these are great quality and human hair:

http://stores.ebay.com/WICKED-WARES-...air-Extensions

[Soheir_Iceland]

Yes you can. It blends in just like glued in extensions. And it feels very secure, it stays put until I take it off. And you can color it, curl it or cut it if you like.

[bul_bul_ksa]

with the clip ins...don't they weaken the root of the hair over time? i'm asking because when you see people that have ALWAYS put their hair back in a bun or ponytail as they got older they seem to have hair recession which I always thought was due to a little bit of genetics and a lot of hair trauma.

[Soheir_Iceland]

Well, I don´t know. Maybe if you use them all the time for years. I only use mine for performances so I´m not worried.

[bdaddiction]

Originally Posted by lilya

Hee! You read my mind: Help me find some fake hair!

Except your post is way more eloquent than mine.... :)

There are some great websites there too... I use the fake ponytails. I dance ballet too, so I need to change up my hair really quick. So it works out.

My hair is long and wavy, but I hate when it is in my face when I dance. If I danced a dance when my hair wouldn't get in the way, I would definately leave it down. Plus, it makes me all hot.

I just don't dye my hair, or blow dry it often. It just makes my hair worse. I wouldn't get a perm just because of the chemical and having to grow it out to start all over again. Although, I can't seem to find a good shampoo/conditioner to use for my hair. Any suggestions?

[aazura]

I agree with what Zumarrad and Ssippes said about perms -- don't do it. I have baby fine hair and went through the perm phase of the 80s. I wanted full, soft waves. I got a curly, frizzy mess. Every time. I often think about trying it out again... that maybe perms have gotten better in the last 20 years... but I don't want to take the risk of ruining my hair (and by the sounds of it, I'm glad I haven't!).

I used to use a 3/4 fall, which looked awesome on -- full, lush, and wavy. But it was like dancing with a wool cap on my head. And I also found that the hair doesn't move like real hair (could be the quality of the fall... maybe I'd have had better luck if I had invested in one made with real hair...dunno). I no longer wear it.

What works for me these days: I keep my hair straight (it doesn't hold a curl for very long anyway). Also, I keep it at a length that emphasizes volume -- for me that seems to be somewhere just past the shoulders and before the back of the bra. When I let it grow past the bra it starts to looks stringy and limp. Also, I've found that keeping my hair healthy and break free is key to keeping it looking its best. Metal clips cause breakage in fine hair and breakage means less volume.

I've never tried the hair clip extensions, though I've heard great things about them. I'm worried about breakage. I'd be curious if anyone's tried those extensions Jessica Simpson uses (can't remember the name).

[Nisima]

Absolutely everything Zummarrad said and I'll add one note; with fine, straight hair you not only have to perm it tighter to get noticeable results, but when it grows out you then *have* to have the roots done or it will look way too flat. Perms on fine straight hair work better with layers - curl lasts longer and overall less damage or at least not as noticeable. If you love the length of your hair, I would NOT perm. Go for 3/4 synthetic hairpieces (category is "fall") or even a clip on synthetic ponytail. Try "wigs.com" - I love the "Wig Pro" brand and they have lots of fairly reasonable ($75 - $120) pieces. You should buy their "color wheel" sample first to get a good color match to hairpiece since your own hair will be showing.

My hair is baby fine, very layered medium length curly permed and semi-permanently colored and every hairdresser I've ever been to says that keeping it in shorter layers is what is allowing me to do this much to my hair. I like what curls do for my face; I just get either 3/4 curly falls or curly ponytails that match my hair color (dark auburn) and people can't even tell it's a hairpiece. The only reason I don't wear a full wig is that it's too hot!

I also do not think it's worth it to invest in a "real" human hair piece - the synthetics are so good now there is no reason to pay $400. Also, synthetics are lighter weight and easier to care for than the human hair ones.

Besides "Wig Pro" another very high quality synthetic wig is "Rene of Paris" but they tend to run anywhere from $25 to $50 more. I have a couple and they are awesome.

My hair is in great condition; curly, colored and layered so well that I basically slap on some shampoo, leave-in conditioner, a bit o' gel and run out the door to class, "fluffing" with fingers once in a while. I'm just waaaaaay too lazy to deal with curling irons, rollers and can't imagine having to "deal" with blow drying my hair every time I shampoo which is every other day due to oily scalp.

Hope this helps, unless you can do at least some long layers, I hate to see you risk damaging all that length of straight hair with a perm that would have to be pretty curly to have much effect. And the touch-ups would have to be "root perms" a couple times a year and while cheaper than full perm, it ain't THAT cheap.

[jmdruadh]

I'm just caught up in the human hair vs. synthetic thing because I used to have a twenty-three inch human hair fall. It was my mom's from the 60s, but it was in beautiful condition: thick, glossy dark brown hair, almost down to mid-back. We lost it in a move when I was in highschool, and it didn't bother me at the time (I was dyeing my hair red), but now I am kicking myself.

[quote=Nisima;4794]

I also do not think it's worth it to invest in a "real" human hair piece - the synthetics are so good now there is no reason to pay $400. Also, synthetics are lighter weight and easier to care for than the human hair ones.

[jmdruadh]

Does your Rene of Paris move well? Because this looks like *exactly* what I'm looking for:
http://www.wigs.com/product_info.php...oducts_id=3425

[quote=Nisima;4794]
Besides "Wig Pro" another very high quality synthetic wig is "Rene of Paris" but they tend to run anywhere from $25 to $50 more. I have a couple and they are awesome.